Mitchell Collector's Reference Guide by Dennis Roberts

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Araye50
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Mitchell Collector's Reference Guide by Dennis Roberts

Post by Araye50 »

Unfortunately for me I found out about Dennis Roberts book a bit to late after it was published in 2000. It was sold out. I've been playing a game of catch up ever since & am amazed that I've yet to find a copy to purchase. Not only that, but I have yet to even find a copy to look at! Interlibrary loan has found 2 copies, 1 library will not loan it, the other might loan it to my library so I can see it there, but it has not happened yet! So much for the information age, can't get there from here!

As a collector & life time user of Mitchell reels I'd really appreciate obtaining a copy to own, to look at, or just to get photocopies of key sections. Has anybody got a copy to sell or loan, does anybody know of such copies, any suggestions at all? The internet has produced nothing. Being an eternally optimistic angler I have to believe there are copies out there gathering dust.

Please be on the look out for this book. Mitchell Collector's Reference Guide by Dennis Roberts is 275 pages, soft bound, 8.5"X11" shiny black cover, filled w/B&W photos & descriptions of virtually every model Mitchell spinning reel ever made. It should be easy to spot at your used book store.
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Robert's book

Post by Jim Madden »

Hello Araye, The books are out there, but folks won't let them go. I have number 53 and won't let it out of my sight. They've sold for hundreds on Ebay and most collectors aren't willing to let them go even for the big dollars. I'd let someone come to my house in South Bend to see it, but that's about it. It can't be copied. The best thing to do is keep posting on lure and reel boards until someone decides that their collection is headed in a different direction and turns one loose. Good luck, Jim
Mitchell302

Mitchell Collector's Reference Guide by Dennis Roberts

Post by Mitchell302 »

My understanding was that the last, signed by author copy, sold on eBay for over $300. Why do you say it can't be copied? You certainly can not legally sell copies, however nothing should stop anyone from copying a few pages for private use. In particular I'm hoping to see the pages devoted to the 302 model line that I'm most interested in. Thank's for your offer, unfortunately South Bend is a bit to far from north Florida for me.
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Post by Jim Madden »

There are 12 pages devoted to the #302. The copyright information in the front of the book state that nothing can be copied by any means for any purpose without permission. I've corresponded with Dennis a number of times and believe he would give permission to a collector for his private use. Dennis's email has unfortunately scrolled off my filing cabinet, but I'm sure someone here could give it to you. Jim
Mitchell302

Mitchell Collector's Reference Guide by Dennis Roberts

Post by Mitchell302 »

That kind of copyright warning is pretty much standard for every book, music album, movie video, etc. If you are that worried about it there is probably no way I could assure you if I got permission from the author in as much as I do not have the book to copy. Only somebody with the book wanting to copy part of it could get such permission. If you know Dennis Roberts that well please ask him for me when you uncover his address. Beginning to feel like the information age is in the crapper.
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Post by Jim Madden »

Before his book came out, Dennis answered a lot of my pestering questions without any hesitation. I'm sure he wouldn't mind some copying since his books are gone, but it is out of respect for him and his contribution to the hobby that I would want to speak to him first. Believe me, I've gone through some of the same frustrations with finding information, but it comes with patience. Whom am I conversing with here?
Does anyone still have Dennis's email address? Jim
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Post by piscesman »

I know where you are coming from. I first met Dennis at the ORCA Show in Rochester,NY in 2000. I bought a book from him being a lifetime Mitchell lover and collector. In the summer of 2002 I took it with me on vacation to Canada. Very nice reading for afternoon relaxation times. My self & family went to town about 18 miles away for lunch. A thunder storm came through the campgrounds and my mitchell book was waterlogged when I returned. You simple can not dry the books pages out seperately. I tried locating a new book but they were ALL SOLD OUT! Finally at a last ditch effort to locate it I was referred a a gentleman in England that helped promote Dennis's guide. He had several on hand and one was coming my way the very next day. I thought it was a liitle more exspensive than the original price(40 versus 60) but I was willing to bite the bullet. A few weeks later they started appearing on Ebay for double my $60. I didn't feel too bad after that. Needless to say it doesn't leave te house anymore. I still have my 1st one as a reminder to be careful with it. Number 85. Wouldn't part with it for nothing... good luck in your search.
Kim :doh: :cry:
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Post by drexelantiques »

I saw the copy on eBay that brought over $300, and I have been offered $300 for my copy.

With that said, I have to say here that I am completely opposed, and appalled, by what I am seeing happening with books on hunting & fishing collectibles. The information should be available to as many folks as possible. Instead authors are deliberately restricting the number of copies they publish so they can either charge as much as possible for the book, or so that it sells for more down the road.

I do not understand why authors feel the necessity to do this.

Tony Dyer, who is a famous African White Hunter published two books a few years ago and limited publication to a limited printing. Those two books now sell for like $2000. I was lucky enough to buy a copy of each, but do not understand why you would not want to get the info to as many people as possible.

I am an author myself, while I have yet to do a book, I have done dozens of articles in various magazines and periodicals.

If an author wants to do a special edition, fine, but they should also do a regular edition so that as many folks as possible get the information at a fair price.
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Post by fishawks »

There is one of these books for sale on Ebay right now. I have seen them go for over $600.00. Dan
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Post by last_phcm »

Wow, this is an old discussion you dug up Dan.
I'd humbly like to offer my thoughts on the limited availability of books mentioned in the above posts. While I am a newbie here, and a relative new comer to collecting Mitchell reels I do have a bit of experience working on special audience publications.
I have worked in various capacities on the making of five cruise books for U.S. Navy ships. From taking the pictures, laying out pages, selling the books or paying the publisher , I am familiar with most all aspects of putting together a 396 page hard bound colored printed coffee table book.
I can state to complete such a book is WORK. (Work, the four letter word.) While I never sat down and calculated the man hours that went into one, I remembered they garnered the better part of my off time during a 6 month deployment. The making of these books was a volunteer effort, i.e. we’d still have a regular job to do. Conservatively, even a couple hours a day for six months is 45 man days of commitment. Typically we’d have a staff with at least three others working that many or more “volunteer” hours. This is time you just can’t redeem.
I can also state it takes money. I remember selling cruise books for the USS Nimitz, USS Kitty Hawk and USS Abraham Lincoln at a loss between for around $30 to $40 a book. These books were 50% funded by the Morale Welfare and Recreation fund. The Sailor's paid the other 50%. Cost for the printer depended on how many books you printed. On an aircraft carrier which houses between 5000-6000 people the most cruise books I can remember ordering was 3200. We were dealing with $125,000 plus publisher bills. That’s a lot of fishing reels!
I can say it is a team effort, the thought of completing such a work alone, is frightening. All my books were group efforts. All had a staff of people photographers and writers, with at least four or five core workers putting it all together. The Mitchell Reel Collector Guide I have lists contributors, but I don’t see any staffers credited. I have to assume layout, copy, and photography work were done by Dennis alone.
Drawing from my lessons learned over the years being involved in such works, I tender this was a labor of love. The limited amount of books were an out of pocket risk that paid back some of the costs, not some clever marketing scheme to command higher prices.
I too have seen the first book sell on eBay in the $400-$600 price range. I believe the tall prices we see today for this first book are nothing more that the just due for the time and effort invested into its creation. Funny thing, I don’t think Dennis is getting any royalties checks for the resale’s.
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Dennis Roberts book

Post by Outtie61 »

I will now be looking to sell I think, as I believe I have 2 copys that should be in new condition. I will have to check what edition to confirm they are first, with me thankfully getting to go home and see them shortly.
Thanks for bringing this up. Merry Christmas to everyone.
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Post by Gone »

Mitchell302 said:
Beginning to feel like the information age is in the crapper.
The information age began in the early eighties by a man I won't mention but I have his correspondence to and from Mitchell, France. To put it mildly, "they" didn't know much at all, only kept financial records, threw away all old catalogs, magazines and so forth.

So what did we learn from this time to say 2006? Not much at all but from 2006 to now, more information has been uncovered than all previous years combined. So my friend, the info age is not in the crapper, it's just begun.

Regarding Dennis' first book, I've sold maybe 15 of these over a couple years. Where I got these is another story but I have one left #011 I'll be selling. Who it was "sold" to makes it a part of Mitchell history, but as I'm starting to believe, that means nothing in value. Wallace
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dr,s book

Post by spirit_of_mitchell »

Hello members

I am new to this group and would just like to comment on the book inquestion.
Spent along time searching for this book, spotted it advertised in another forum, being new to collecting mitchell reels i was kind of obsessed with having a copy. Cutting a long story short i bid on every book i saw on ebay until i finally got one and no offence to mr roberts but i have never been so disapointed in a book that cost so much :shock: .
I had the book 3 days before i sold it on, a shame really as i so wanted that book. :(
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Mitchell Collector's Reference Guide by Dennis Roberst

Post by Ben »

Hi Spirit-of Mitchell,
I am the author of "THE WRIGHT PRICE GUIDE FOR THE REEL MAN" books relating to spinniing reels.
myself and Dennis Roberts started in this hobby well over 25 years ago when there were no publications available on spinniing reels, no internet fishing reel websites, and especially no Ebay formuns.
Dennis started the formation of his book in 1996, twelve years ago, with my help which he published in 2000. as a mitchell collector you have to realize that the information in a book that is close to 12 years old is not going to be as comprehensive and detailed as what you can find on line in 2009. Dennis' book was the starting point for this hobby when nothing was out there. it was the first pictorial reference guide available that ignited interest in the hobby. the price you paid for that book is a collector's value for the book, If I remember correctly, Dennis was selling copies for $36.00. personally , and I think you would find many others who agree, both his publications provided detailed pictures of reels and information that were not readily available in mainstream collecting.
I hope this provides you with a different perspective of this book.
Ben Wright
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Post by Araye50 »

Guess I need to comment on this Lazarus (June 2005) thread's revival. I too became "kind of obsessed with having a copy" but had no illusions about paying $300-$600 for one & stuck it out. My illusion was about the rarity of the Mitchell book, I'd presumed it was more common. I wasted a lot of time searching used books online & on the ground, before learning that only a little more than 500 books were printed. A librarian described it as "vanity publishing" where the author doesn't need to sell their book to a publisher. Instead they contract directly w/the printer.

Ultimately I acquired a used copy for a little more than original cost. While the book is not perfect in every way, I can not imagine any true Mitchell fan being "so disapointed" w/it. The 'Mitchell Collector's Reference Guide' was an instant classic. Dennis Roberts gave Mitchell fans a 2nd chance by publishing the 'Mitchell Collector's Value Guide' in 2006. IMO Mr. Roberts learned more than enough information between 2000 & 2006 to justify his 2nd Mitchell book. For some of us "the info age" actually began decades ago. These books expose a great deal of "Mitchell history". Their true "value" is in the wealth of "information" compiled before 2006.
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Post by spirit_of_mitchell »

Hello ben

Many thanks for the reply, i have to agree that information at that time was very hard to come by i also appreciate the hard work that dennis put in to his work likewise the work you may have done with your book but the problem i had was how much i had to pay for a book which sort of seemed out of date, again i see that at the time info was not available and the book was giving an insight to mitchell reels , its just that i cant see why the book is so exspensive i mean has anybody ever paid $400 for one of your books? I know some will say "whats he going on about" or "where is this going" but all i was saying was about my personal disapointment. Lets face it here, anybody considering doing a book now will just go and copy all of wallace carneys hard work from his incredible website, work which is nothing short of 100%. If it aint documented you wont read it there which is were i am going with this. Could i ask you ben do you as a book writer think that the mitchell reel museum is the new mitchell book allbeit free?
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Post by escharfie »

I agree with Ben's comments.

The subject of the book is collecting reels. However it's value now has transcended that. It's value is not about what you can learn from it anymore. The book is now a collectors item in itself because of what it represents, and the amount of hard work and years of research that went into it.

Thank You, Dennis.

ED
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Ben
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Mitchell Collectors Reference Guide by Dennis Roberts

Post by Ben »

Hi Spirit-of-Mitchell,
To answer your question and not belabor this subject and further, I offer the following for your edification. mitchell pioneers like Dennis Roberts, Jan Haanstra, Joy van Hengst, Luc deMedts, Herman Verswijveren, Christian Lhermitte, Bernard Caminide,Bill Arp, Hugh DeCheri and Barry Frewing , just to name a few, all have contributed to the collective knowledge in the hobby to date. many years before the mitchell reel museum, there was another mitchell website that was called the Mitchell Reel Collectors International , unfortunatley now defunct, it was at one time one of the best sources of mitchell information.
that site was the brain-child of Mr. Roberts's years before the Mitchell Reel Museum was established as I was one of its contributing writers.
This is in no way to criticize the Mitchell Reel Museum and what it offers Mitchell collectors. the section with reel studies are excellent but to say mr. Reads site is, as you indicated "The New Mitchell Book" is not true!
one cannot compare published work to that of a website. the website has the ability to replenish itself with new and current information. whereas a book remains fastened to the moment in time when published until a revised publication is printed.
so to critique Mr. Roberts book as "disappointing" in comparison to that of a 2009 website on the same subject matter is unfair and disrespectful to the man who has given so much to this hobby.
To answer your other question, the 3rd Edition 2002 of my book has been sold out for some time. there were 527 copies made, the selling price new was $39.95. they now sell on ebay for over $100.00 but very few are listed on ebay. My 2006 Supplement to the 3rd edition is still available.
I am currently working on another complete book on spinning reels but it will not be out for a while,
Also as a courtesy, in the future, if you want to post, it would be gentlemanly like to provide your name so we know who we are talking with, especially to one who is new to this site Thank you
Ben

Last edited on Wed Jan 07, 2009 10:00 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Gone »

Gentlemen,

This topic is about DR first book. With that said; that book is now highly collectable with high value which IMO will continue to grow. It was the first Mitchell actual "book" in English with pictures of reels. Like I believe any first version should be, its value is historical which IMO is most important.

This book had the most positive effect on me to do my own research. I also discovered others including Barry Frewing's "Mitchell Birth of a Legend" authored in 1996 and; the 100 Year History of Carpano & Pons also authored in 1996 by Carpano & Pons Archives they called "100 Ans d’Aventure Industrielle, d’Eau et d’Electricité." These years may be off a little, I'm not home to check.

IMO, these inspired all future studies, books and websites to continue with Mitchell's legacy. Naturally "Mitchell Story" published by France Régions should be duly noted as another great and IMO very best Mitchell historical book ever written even bound in hard copy. Unfortunately it was written in French only.

What most don't know is Bill Arp was the first true Mitchell collector USA and actually the first to display Mitchell reels at trade shows! During this same time he was in deep communication with Carpano & Pons/Mitchell requesting any information/records. I have Mr. Arp's original correspondence to prove this. Dennis Roberts first met Mr. Arp at a tackle trade show. This meeting was the beginning of DR's enthusiastic and unprecedented efforts to gather pictures and information to complete his first "actual" book on Mitchell.

At approximately the same time as Mr. Arp, Barry Frewing in The UK was also doing legwork in many attempts to recover/save Mitchell history. This started when Mitchell Service suddenly and unexpected left his country for unknown reasons at the time. He met the same fate as Mr. Arp attempts to locate and preserve Mitchell, or what Mr. Frewing told me was "a brick wall" so to speak. That "brick wall" still exists today, which is another topic.

So in my humble opinion only; I will always see Misters Arp and Frewing as the founding historical fathers; Mr. Frewing and Carpano & Pons as the first historians; Mr. Roberts as the first true Mitchell (English) author; Mr. Luc de Medts website “Mitchell Collectors International” as the first free source of valuable Mitchell information (non-active); Jan Haanstra as the most knowledgeable overall collector with another great website (active); James Entwistle as the largest Mitchell reel collector of historical significance; Doug DeSimone and JP Gumprich as the best living sources of historical facts; Group Carpano & Pons archives as the cleanest source of pre-Mitchell facts; Mike Read who’s contributed more financially to preserve Mitchell history than everyone else combined and for owning/sharing the most highly prized Mitchell collectables in the world and; Christian Lhermitte being the most passionate and giving Mitchell collector ever.

There are so many others who deserve credit for their contributions I can’t list them all. Most of these others gave so others could author, some gave so others could study, and some just gave because it’s the right thing to do. Of course this is my opinion only as always. Wallace
Last edited by Gone on Wed Jan 07, 2009 1:49 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Post by Brian F. »

It is obvious there are differences in opinion on this. Thank you all for contributing. Please take your personal differences off of this site and consider this a warning. If this conversation cannot continue without arguing with each other, we will need to take further action. Please see your personal mail.
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Re: Mitchell Collector's Reference Guide by Dennis Roberts

Post by ErieDearie »

Hello everyone. New here and have a question. I know this is a very old thread. While researching the value of a book on the net, it brought me to this site. Anyway I have this book and was wondering about the current value. It is # 219 of the first edition in like new condition. Any help appreciated before the SIL puts it on ebay.

Thanks
John
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Midway Tommy D
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Re: Mitchell Collector's Reference Guide by Dennis Roberts

Post by Midway Tommy D »

A 7 day listing starting @ $.99 with no reserve will pretty much, in the end, tell you what it is worth. They don't come available very often.
Love those Open Face Spinning Reels! (Especially ABU & ABU/Zebco)

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Re: Mitchell Collector's Reference Guide by Dennis Roberts

Post by ErieDearie »

Thank You!
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