Distributors
Distributors
Does anyone have a good list of companies i.e. H S & B Hardware with full names? Reels and Rods if available.
Al Stover
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Re: Distributors
Such a list would be impossible, I would think, involving thousands of retailers, wholesalers and reel & rod models. Good luck on that one! You might want to start "smaller".
Mark
Mark
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Re: Distributors
Al,
The trademark database will give you most of them. It's available here on the ORCA website or contact ORCA member Alan Baracco. Colby
The trademark database will give you most of them. It's available here on the ORCA website or contact ORCA member Alan Baracco. Colby
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Re: Distributors
Folks,
Al's request is kind of a puzzler to me, first of all, what is a "Distributor"? I guess Southbend would qualify, since they made no reels themselves. The FRR area contains all of the Trademark data for reels, 1870 to 1960, as Colby pointed out, but that is a mix of actual people and companies that actually got a Trademark, gotta believe many did not. Big job, I agree with Mark, but again the FRR area gives it a good go.
Alan
Al's request is kind of a puzzler to me, first of all, what is a "Distributor"? I guess Southbend would qualify, since they made no reels themselves. The FRR area contains all of the Trademark data for reels, 1870 to 1960, as Colby pointed out, but that is a mix of actual people and companies that actually got a Trademark, gotta believe many did not. Big job, I agree with Mark, but again the FRR area gives it a good go.
Alan
- Ron Mc
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Re: Distributors
I'm going to assume he's talking merchants who bought marked trade reels.
HSB&Co was Hibbard, Spencer, Barlett and Co. - 4th partner Conover had his name reversed for their Rev-O-Noc brand. OVB - Our very best was another brand, and HSB&Co Diamond brand. Later became True Value Hardware.
Rev-O-Noc marked Pflueger trade reel, and HSB&Co Diamond brand knife
I also have some Rev-O-Noc nesting camp cups.
Other hardware store brands are Union, Simmons, Shapleighs, of course, Western Auto (Revelation).
No reels, but I have nice Simmons (Hornet) and Shapleigh knives - early postwar Solingen steel.
Sears sold trade reels as Higgins and later Ted Williams
Wards sold trade reels as Hawthorne and Sport King
JC Penney even marked some trade reels.
Sporting goods stores with their marked brands is going to be a long list.
Richardson of Chicago, William Mills, Abbie & Imbrie, Aberchrombie & Fitch
If you search Sterling brand on this forum, you'll find this one - H.A. Whittemore of Boston
Didn't Dr. Todd do an article series on sporting goods stores and hardware stores?
And of course if you include the Brits, every gunsmith had their marked reels, the lion's share made for them by JWYoung & Sons of Redditch, though this reel is a Dingley.
HSB&Co was Hibbard, Spencer, Barlett and Co. - 4th partner Conover had his name reversed for their Rev-O-Noc brand. OVB - Our very best was another brand, and HSB&Co Diamond brand. Later became True Value Hardware.
Rev-O-Noc marked Pflueger trade reel, and HSB&Co Diamond brand knife
I also have some Rev-O-Noc nesting camp cups.
Other hardware store brands are Union, Simmons, Shapleighs, of course, Western Auto (Revelation).
No reels, but I have nice Simmons (Hornet) and Shapleigh knives - early postwar Solingen steel.
Sears sold trade reels as Higgins and later Ted Williams
Wards sold trade reels as Hawthorne and Sport King
JC Penney even marked some trade reels.
Sporting goods stores with their marked brands is going to be a long list.
Richardson of Chicago, William Mills, Abbie & Imbrie, Aberchrombie & Fitch
If you search Sterling brand on this forum, you'll find this one - H.A. Whittemore of Boston
Didn't Dr. Todd do an article series on sporting goods stores and hardware stores?
And of course if you include the Brits, every gunsmith had their marked reels, the lion's share made for them by JWYoung & Sons of Redditch, though this reel is a Dingley.
Last edited by Ron Mc on Mon Nov 27, 2017 7:34 am, edited 5 times in total.
- Midway Tommy D
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Re: Distributors
At what point do you differentiate or separate distributors from importers? A few well know examples in spinning reels would be Thommen, Garcia, Tradewinds, Roddy, Zebco, etc. Garcia never manufactured any reels until ABU took them over and Zebco distributed the ABU Cardinal series' in the US. I agree with Mark, that list would be almost never ending.
Love those Open Face Spinning Reels! (Especially ABU & ABU/Zebco)
Tom DeLong, NE
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Tom DeLong, NE
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Re: Distributors
There is the FRR list of distributors http://www.orcaonline.org/reel-distributors/ that I thought you worked on and there are several listed in the library holdings. What are you looking for Al?
Paul Manuel
Member since 2006
Member since 2006
Re: Distributors
After asking the question, I realized that Don Champion had provided me with an extensive list that contained makers and distributors. I still have. my goal was to build a list like HSB&Co = Hibbett, Spencer, Barlett and Co. these logos are not always obvious to everyone. Thanks Paul for reminding me that I did that a month or so past. I still have Don's list. Thanks to all of you for the feedback.
Al Stover
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Re: Distributors
since Rev-O-Noc has your attention right now Al, here's a nice copystand of a 30s HSB&Co catalog overleaf page. A photo barely does it justice, there's real silver in the silver paint.
also please note, I transcribed a google miss - the first surname in the company is Hibbard.
fwiw, there's a similar level of effort identifying makers of old bicycles with hardware store or department store labels
also please note, I transcribed a google miss - the first surname in the company is Hibbard.
fwiw, there's a similar level of effort identifying makers of old bicycles with hardware store or department store labels
Last edited by Ron Mc on Sun Nov 26, 2017 6:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
- Ron Mc
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Re: Distributors
The idea of maker and distributor gets really confused in Brit catalogs. S. Allcock Co. and Farlow's as the best examples.
Both sold marked reels made by all the Great Britain shops from Alnwick, Redditch, Birmingham and Perth (Allcock also imported Bronson).
The 1935 Farlow catalog is the perfect example.
They sold 45 reel models. Five of these reels were made by Farlow in Croydon, yet their catalog copy states for every reel model they were made in Croydon, though many are Obviously JW Young, Heaton, Smith & Wall.
Sharpes of Aberdeen sold Dingley and Young reels along with reels they made. Pre- and post-war, Allcock was buying shops in England and Scotland.
In 1955, Farlow acquired Sharpes, and about the same time, Dickson & Sons acquired Alex Martin, and JJS Walker-Bampton of Alnwick.
It goes crazy in the 60s, with Allcock, Young, Lee and (German) Noris acquired by Topp Tackle, then Shakespeare USA bought Topp Tackle.
Both sold marked reels made by all the Great Britain shops from Alnwick, Redditch, Birmingham and Perth (Allcock also imported Bronson).
The 1935 Farlow catalog is the perfect example.
They sold 45 reel models. Five of these reels were made by Farlow in Croydon, yet their catalog copy states for every reel model they were made in Croydon, though many are Obviously JW Young, Heaton, Smith & Wall.
Sharpes of Aberdeen sold Dingley and Young reels along with reels they made. Pre- and post-war, Allcock was buying shops in England and Scotland.
In 1955, Farlow acquired Sharpes, and about the same time, Dickson & Sons acquired Alex Martin, and JJS Walker-Bampton of Alnwick.
It goes crazy in the 60s, with Allcock, Young, Lee and (German) Noris acquired by Topp Tackle, then Shakespeare USA bought Topp Tackle.
- kyreels
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Re: Distributors
Our FFR list cited by Paul can really use some updates. I note it is missing:
Belknap Hardware
Sutcliff's Sporting Goods
Peaslee-Gaulbert Co
A favorite of mine is misspelled, Stratton & Terstegge Co, distributor of Falls City tackle boxes and minnow buckets, as well as various trade reels.
I would agree that such a list is difficult if you make it exhaustive. Sutcliffe is a good example of a specialty distributor of sporting goods only, and their customers were small-town sporting stores and bait shops.
Belknap Hardware
Sutcliff's Sporting Goods
Peaslee-Gaulbert Co
A favorite of mine is misspelled, Stratton & Terstegge Co, distributor of Falls City tackle boxes and minnow buckets, as well as various trade reels.
I would agree that such a list is difficult if you make it exhaustive. Sutcliffe is a good example of a specialty distributor of sporting goods only, and their customers were small-town sporting stores and bait shops.
Matt Wickham
Collector of Casting Weights, KY Reels and KY Tackle
Collector of Casting Weights, KY Reels and KY Tackle
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Re: Distributors
Thank you Matt. The FRR Distributor list has been updated with this info.
Paul Manuel
Member since 2006
Member since 2006
Re: Distributors
I still have no idea what you guys mean by "distributor." The FRR quote sounds as if you're trying to list every store in the country that sold reels not made by the store. Why? If that's not what you mean, tell us.This page documents the many reel distributors who sold reels made by other companies.
Steve Vernon
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"Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose."
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Re: Distributors
Gentlemen, when I worked on the distributors page of the research site, I had in mind only those companies that put their names on at least one reel which had it's own company's box. That's still a huge number, but it eliminates those who distributed reels with original company names. In the end, anyone who had a reel with a strange name could find it on the site. I tried to keep up with Tod's articles on reels of the trade with short synapses on the site, but he was too fast for me. JIm
Desperately seeking SB reel #100A, a #600 box. JMadden
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Re: Distributors
good work Jim.
- kyreels
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Re: Distributors
Seems good to me. Based on that description, I would characterize the list as "Distributors of Fishing Reels that also had at least one private-label reel". Eliminates OEMs and distributor-only smaller firms. But it doesnt speak directly to whether the distributor's name was directly on the reel or box, that is still a grey area.
Matt Wickham
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Re: Distributors
Heddon, one of the largest sellers of Shakespeare-made reels for 13 years (1930-1942), is not on the list of "Distributors". Horrocks-Ibbotson Co. is another major distributor not on the list (with reels supplied to them by Bronson Reel Co. and others). I, too, find the list rather confusing. Also, the distributor's name was often not seen on any of their private label reels, but rather a model name. To my knowledge, Edw. K. Tryon Co.'s name never appeared on a reel, yet they were one of the major distributors of trade reels in this country, with their "Kingfisher" and other trade marked brand names.
Mark
Mark
- kyreels
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Re: Distributors
Based on Jim's description, Heddon was an OEM (original equip manufacturer) and thus not a distributor. Many manufacturers sourced reels from others, but were not distributors per se. A definition of distributor could be a non-manufacturer that sourced reels from others and distributed to retailers.
Matt Wickham
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Re: Distributors
Heddon did not manufacture their own casting reels from 1930 until the 1960's. All their casting reels were built for them by Shakespeare (1930-1942) and then by Bronson (1947-1960). How could they be considered an OEM company?kyreels wrote:Based on Jim's description, Heddon was an OEM (original equip manufacturer) and thus not a distributor. Many manufacturers sourced reels from others, but were not distributors per se. A definition of distributor could be a non-manufacturer that sourced reels from others and distributed to retailers.
- Ron Mc
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Re: Distributors
Jack Welch.
But I can also support the Heddon Little Rivers fly reel was a 1st model Shakespeare Russell.
Likewise, I'm pretty sure Heddon built the 125 Imperial in Dowiagic.
But I can also support the Heddon Little Rivers fly reel was a 1st model Shakespeare Russell.
Likewise, I'm pretty sure Heddon built the 125 Imperial in Dowiagic.
- Midway Tommy D
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Re: Distributors
Heddon built their own open faced spinners early on, before they switched to the Japanese Heddons. Their auto fly reels, though, were made by Shakespeare.
Love those Open Face Spinning Reels! (Especially ABU & ABU/Zebco)
Tom DeLong, NE
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Tom DeLong, NE
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- kyreels
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Re: Distributors
I wouldn't disagree with any of those observations, at some point it's just a judgment call. I think Heddon is not primarily a distributor, but I can see how if you were searching for a certain rebranded reel style, it would be helpful to know that. But if you include one manufacturer, you have to include a bunch of them.
In the end, it's the list editors call.
In the end, it's the list editors call.
Matt Wickham
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Re: Distributors
Heddon is a good example. I would argue that you have to place it under "manufacturers" on the research site and add the history of contracting Bronson and Shakespeare within the regular Heddon history, including the names of the
some of the best-known reels. There might be some duplicated information under Bronson and Shakespeare, but that's ok. The researcher would then know to go to those two companies for more information. If they used the search feature to find Indian Chief, for example, the reel would hopefully show up in at least one of the two companies. Also, a note could be added to seek more information from one of the Reel News articles on Heddon or Bronson. It's impossible to list every reel. I agree that it's tough apply the best labels.
some of the best-known reels. There might be some duplicated information under Bronson and Shakespeare, but that's ok. The researcher would then know to go to those two companies for more information. If they used the search feature to find Indian Chief, for example, the reel would hopefully show up in at least one of the two companies. Also, a note could be added to seek more information from one of the Reel News articles on Heddon or Bronson. It's impossible to list every reel. I agree that it's tough apply the best labels.
Desperately seeking SB reel #100A, a #600 box. JMadden