South Bend #50

[Paul Roberts]

Thanks, Jim. This reel has the white grips. Very little markings, just "South Bend #50" and "South Bend famous in fishing" on the face plate.

[Paul Roberts]

Update, and thoughts on my SB #50:

Mine is likely a Gladding version, with the white grips, and appears to be nearly new, hardly used. It's a pretty reel but, in hand, looks and feels like a cheap reel. It has no AB system, and spool tension is touchy, and... feels cheap. Very noisy when casting, with a screaming screeching metallic whirr. So noisy I feel I wouldn't want to be on the water with it. So, I took it back to the bench to see what I could possibly do to quiet it.

A chunk of the problem, besides overall cheap-ness, and poor spool tension adjustment capability, is the all aluminum plates, frame, and spool make for something of a resonating chamber. Looking more closely, upon the second tear-down, the spool comes in very close to the frame, possibly able to touch, if ever so slightly. The frame and spool edges are sharp -could possibly cut flesh if I wasn't careful- and I wondered if they might "ring" with near contact. I took steel wool and smoothed those edges. I then adhered pieces of foam (mounting) tape inside that resonating chamber, hoping to dampen that a bit. The main gear takes up so much space there's not much room for insulation.



Back out casting again I found it may be a tad quieter, at least a slightly lower pitch (lol). But it still screams. Don't think there's much that can be done. It casts reasonably well, although the spool tension requires a very narrow range. Also, poor tolerances allows 12lb Legend to get in behind the spool; The only vintage reel I have that has done that.

Will try to burn it in some more but it may not end up a keeper, pretty as it is. I've always liked that light metallic green anodized finish, having two fly reels in that finish, one an early Hardy Princess.

[Jim Madden]

Paul, you certainly gave it the college try! It's ironic because those large, direct drive gears were advertised as being the new quit running combination. I wonder if someone dropped that spool at one time. One drop on those, and it's noisy, or at very worst, trashed.

[Paul Roberts]

Hi, Jim. Yes! I am not afraid, and enjoy, getting creative. I'd read that Nylon gears were supposed to be quiet. I see no indications of spool or frame damage. Just reeling it, it sounds like gears; a buzzing whirr. The gears look fine, no damage. I did not grease the gears, however, they being Nylon. Maybe I should try that next. Should Nylon gears greased?

[Jim Madden]

I just use a thin oil on the gears, but you might want to try some Hot Sauce oil on the spool ends. The spool should be perfectly centered with a slight play on either side. I pulled out my SB model and later Gladding era 50’s model and didn’t notice more then a slight whir sound with nothing metal sounding, but I didn’t have line on it and just had to twirl the handle. The SB reel was quieter. They are handsome little reels.

[Paul Roberts]

More casting with this reel... It casts well. It will pitch (weight in hand, underhand) 75ft with a 1/2oz weight and 12lb Mason Legend easily, with no backlash issues at this range; No thumbing needed, the weight/line slowing down gently at that range. The spool tension controls are touchy with a very precise place where they support, but not interfere with, the spool tension. A fraction of a turn makes a difference, esp on the tail side, which made me wonder if there might be a missing bearing plate. I checked the schematic from the ORCA library and see that there is only an end cap nut, no extra bearings.

The reel is still loud. Right now there are a couple inches of powder snow out there, and that helps! ) There appears to be no spool-frame contact. The noise is a loud whirr -a turbocharger sound is my best spin on it. I'm guessing that's gear noise, resonating in that hollow aluminum box. Curious if others have this reel, or the Shakespeare version (1973D), and how noisy they might be.

Again, it is a pretty reel, to my eye. I'll probably fish it some, and continue to play with noise reduction ideas.

[wrong99]

I have both the #50 and 1973D. Both are smooth & quiet.

[Paul Roberts]

Thanks, Mark. What do you think is most likely to be up with this reel? Spool? Gears? I'll take it apart again and go through everything more closely.

[Ron Mc]

Paul, nylon gears is my thought - if you have a magnifier look to see if the gear teeth are brinnelled - flared out on the sides - that material would come from the gear contact faces. My fished-hard Mitchell with nylon gears sounds like a freight train.

[Midway Tommy D]

Paul, nylon gears is my thought - if you have a magnifier look to see if the gear teeth are brinnelled - flared out on the sides - that material would come from the gear contact faces. My fished-hard Mitchell with nylon gears sounds like a freight train.

Most all Mitchells sound like freight trains, though. I have seldom handled a really quiet one. Too many spur gears and other moving parts, me thinks.

[wrong99]

Paul,
If you want my #50 to cannibalize, the offer still stands.

[Paul Roberts]

Ron, I'll do that. The reel looks like it's scarcely been out of a desk drawer, but maybe it was used as an early fidget spinner!

Tom, Yes! I've had a few Mitchell's, and tended to wear them out. The last one I bought new in the 80's. Material quality had fallen by then. I caught a bunch of steelhead and salmon on that reel -back-reeling- and it sounded like a coffee can full of gravel when I finally discarded it. And I haven't "discarded" many reels over the years.

Mark, Yes! I'd like this reel to work. And, I'd like to know what's wrong with it. PM sent.

[Paul Roberts]

OK... I've done what I can do with this reel. Gear teeth look fine. The little pinion (?) gear at the end of the spool has the very slightest curve, or lean, to the teeth, but I had to look really hard. I doubt it's the gear teeth. I also greased them this time, just enough to glisten the teeth. I believe the noise is in the spool/shaft. The tension nuts are really touchy; Too much so it seems. The face side needs to be tightened down some to get rid of spool grinding, and allowing the spool to spin freely. That seems pretty normal. The tail side, however, needs to be backed off all the way or it slows the spool substantially (just another partial turn and it will lock the spool entirely). This is what had me thinking there is a missing part. But, I find nothing missing compared with the schematic. Baffled. Will wait to see the reel Mark sends me. Dying to know what it looks like inside.

[jgestar]

Paul, Your description makes me think the spindle/spindle bearings are worn out. Two questions: First, was there any oil in the bearings when you received the reel? or just a lot of black sludge? Second, take the end cap off the handle side of the reel. If you push the spool toward and away from the reel foot does the spindle appear to move side to side in the bearing?

If the spindle/bearings are worn out, the reel will be noisy and will get worse with time.


Tom

[Paul Roberts]

I think you've identified the problem, Tom. There is play in the bearings. Surprising because the reel looks so new. It doesn't appear to have been fished. Possibly someone used it, and wore it out, as a distance/tournament reel? Thanks for the comment. I'm much less baffled now. Thing still casts well, and looks good. Perhaps I could tell annoyed fishers around me that it's turbocharged.

[jgestar]

Typically we use thin oil in spindle bearings, such as Hot Sauce or Rocket Fuel. A worn bearing may work better with thicker oil. Try motor oil in the bearings, or gear oil if you have it. Because the gap between the bearing and spindle is larger the thick oil won't slow things as much as it would with good bearings. It's a cheap fix if it works.


Tom

[Paul Roberts]

Thanks, Tom. Will try it.

[Paul Roberts]

Tom, that was a great call. From a thousand miles away! Here it is up close. The bearing is worn down along the bottom edge. I'm going to guess this narrow-spooled reel was used for a lot of distance casting and didn't see much fishing time.

[Ron Mc]

I'd take one of the gracious gift offers to fish - that reel has been fished dry for too long.

[wrong99]

Maybe swap out the tail plate from the one I sent you.

[Paul Roberts]

Ron, yes, perhaps. Not sure this would've made the best distance reel. They obviously took care of the outside of the reel though. Mark (wrong99) is sending me one. I hate to just discard this one.

Mark, yes, that might be the best route. We'll see what I have with the two reels together. I'll give an update after it arrives.

[Paul Roberts]

Well, this has morphed into a Cleaning & Restoration thread. Not surprising, since... that's what happens with an old reel once you decide to buy it.

Mark, the Shakespeare 1973D you sent has arrived. Pretty thing it is! I haven't opened it up yet, but already see a difference in the spool shaft bearings. There appears to be a supporting piece in the 1973D bearing that is not in the 50. Is it missing, or... a cost-cutting effort by South Bend?

SB50:

S1973D:


Funny... seeing the two sitting side by side, there's something 'romantic' about this match up; I can't quite put my finger on it. I almost feel like we've arranged a marriage here. Will be sure to let you know how things turn out, Mark.
The happy couple:

[wrong99]

Sorry, Paul. Thought I had sent you a SB#50. Great attention to detail, huh? Maybe next time I'll actually "look" at it. Getting old sucks!
Mark

[Paul Roberts]

No worries. Essentially the same reel it seems. I'm curious to open them up and see how the two differ. And how a tail plate swap might come out.

[Paul Roberts]

Well... the wedding is off! There will be no parts swapping. The Shakespeare version (1973D) is a higher quality reel overall. South Bend (50), or likely Gladding in this case, cut too many corners, reducing the quality and even number of parts in some places, to accomplish something similar to the Shakespeare version. The real (reel) killer being the lack of the shaft support collar within the spool end cap bearings. They remain tight in the 1973D, but worn out of round and sloppy in the 50. After a thorough scrubbing and lubing (although the starting condition was not bad), the Shakespeare spins like a top, and quietly. The jilted groom in this case is still a screaming banshee and will probably remain so, to sit on a shelf and look handsome. I don't think I could be comfortable selling it. What would I say? "Nice looking... An unsophisticate that finally went totally insane."