Need Help W/ ID On Unmarked

[joe klaus]

A couple of very knowledgeable guys have seen this reel but having some difficulty getting a definite ID on maker (and perhaps we never will get one). Naturally the reel is completely unmarked. Best guess so far has been U.S. Twine & Net/Spalding. Also have a Malloch guess.

Can anyone shed more light on maker of this one? Very simple reel. Measures 3 5/8 diameter and spool is roughly 2".

[Roger Schulz]

By looking at the foot, I would say Star Reel Works or Koph.

Roger

[joe klaus]

Thanks Roger. I appreciate your looking. Dave Lehman mentioned the possibility of Koph, but he thought likely a reel that Spalding sold and I assume would have been made by U. S. Net (maybe). Don Champion thinks U S Net as a likely. I know myself well enough to be puzzled as to why I have this one. I think I did go through a short phase of collecting reels that were somehow related to Kosmic (and therefore I assume a previous owner may have called this an early Kosmic).

In checking Ron Gast's excellent resource, I see that Spalding had reels sold to them by Kosmic. And Kosmic apparently had reels made for them by Julius VH.

[Steve]

I would lean slightly toward Malleson. Definitely not Kopf or Star. See pg. 325 of my book.

[john elder]

Here’s a very similar reel with same foot but fancier knurling and handle. It is marked “The Kosmic Reel” on the face plate but may be too light to see in the pic. Seems more likely to be Mallessin than JVH... just don’t see and Julius there.its interesting in that mine is stamped in the middle of the foot with a serial number rather than yardage. Looks like joes is likely yards.

[Steve]

Might as well rule out the foot-based Malleson ID, too.

[joe klaus]

Many thanks to all that responded. I sincerely appreciate. And I got to tell you guys that it seems like I'm starting to lose a step. My original post stated that someone threw out a Malloch guess, and in fact, they said Malleson.

Would love to hear more opinions.

[BILL HOERTER]

Joe you can find your reel in the 1904-05 Enterprise Mfg. Co. catalog. Also you can find an article I wrote on your reel in the May 2017 page 17 ORCA Reel News. Now who made it I am not sure but it is in the Enterprise catalog & it shows the wrapped foot like some other early cataloged Enterprise reels. I have 2 of these reels in my Enterprise early salt water reel collection. One is just like the one in the catalog with the white handle knob & the other one is marked M.A. SHIPLEY PHILA. It has a Shipley's PAT. Handle Drag on it with a brown handle knob. The foot is more heavily wrapped & the arbor is smaller. When you see an early hard rubber or metal salt water reel that has the 2 click rivets straight across in line with the end cap in other words at 9 o:clock on the back plate you can bet that it is a PFLUEGER ENTERPRISE reel. That one piece of knowledge has helped me more than any thing else in finding PFLUEGER reels for my collection & I have fellow ORCA PFL. collector Craig Barber to thank for that.

[Steve]

Here is Dr. E's reel, as shown in an H.J. Frost catalog, allegedly 1901. Frost worked at USN&T for a few years, before opening his own shop at 310 Broadway, where T.J. Conroy had operated. I think that Montague probably just continued to make many of the USN&T reels after 1899. Their major contribution to reelmaking was the widespread use of cute names for everything they made.


Bill, I reread your article and remembered I had the OVB reel, too...luckily still have some pics. There are some subtle differences between the OVB and Joe's reel. If Enterprise did, in fact, make the OVB, all they did was copy the USN&T/Montague reel, IMHO.

[john elder]

Another one i have... pretty much same as Joes but not even yardage on thisone

[Steve]

pretty much same as Joes

One...me, actually...begs to differ. I suspect yours is more Kopfian than Joe's. Here's a pic of a Kopf tailplate. Check out your spool flange fastenings and the crank screw. I'll bet your plates are celluloid, rather than HR.

[john elder]

My spool flanges arethe same as joes and no, Reel is not celluloid.

[Steve]

This is what appears to differ.

[joe klaus]

I appreciate all the comments. In response to Bill, I initially thought the reel was Enterprise/Pflueger. But then communicated initially with Dave Lehman and Don Champion and both said, more likely than not, U.S.Net.

I picked the reel off one of my shelves holding Pflueger. That means (to me) that whoever sold it to me represented it as Pflueger and either (1.) I paid very little for it and therefore just thought it was neat and didn't pay much more attention or (2.) If I paid over 50 bucks, I would have known and trusted the seller and had good reason to believe he knew what he was selling and/or made an independent investigation before I bought it.

Also in response to Bill, Dave Lehman and I both looked through the early Plfueger catalogs, and we could not say with certainty we could identify mine as Pflueger. (don't remember exact reason for that at the moment) I will look at the 1904-5 catalog again.

[Steve]

For what it's worth, here's a comparison of Joe's reel (on the left) and an OVB reel.

[john elder]

Well, that certainly proves that they are not the same reel

[joe klaus]

Interesting tid-bit from article written in year 2000 by Bad Bob entitled "A Look Back at the Pflueger Era". In his article, Bob writes that ".........in 1899 they (i.e. Enterprise) acquired a part of the U.S. Net and Twine Company, a large manufacturer of tackle at the time, and who had reel making tools and dies (conversation with Craig Barber). Perhaps that equipment got the Pfluegers a head start."

So based upon the above information provided by Craig (and Bob), perhaps this could explain why Enterprise did make early reels that were very similar in appearance to those made by U.S. Net.

[wrong99]

I thought Montague purchased U.S. Net & Twine in 1899?

[joe klaus]

I believe you are quite right Mark. Apparently Craig believed that Enterprise got part of their manufacturing equipment around that same time. And naturally, his opinion on Enterprise is, as a general rule, pretty much gospel.

[Steve]

acquired a part of the U.S. Net and Twine Company

A part. An upcoming article will have a little more info on USN&T.

[Steve]

Name That Maker, Episode CXIV:

[joe klaus]

I give up