Reel cleaning vs reel restoration

[Sir fishalot]

Hello everyone,
I have a question.
Would a good cleaning, including taking apart and removing all the old grease reassembling with fresh grease and a good polishing be considered a restoration?
Thank you, Mike

[kyreels]

Mike, in my opinion a cleaning and lubrication of a reel is not considered restoration. Good polishing could cross the line, but in general recommended polishing methods do not cross that line. Cases of hard rubber restoration that removes and/or adds material can constitute restoration, same for metal really. When a really awful and corroded reel is fully cleaned, including removal of corrosion, it is sometimes referred to as restored. In general terms, replacement of parts is where the line is crossed, however, replacing a part with the exact item from another reel does not normally constitute restoration. But that line is gray. Replacing a part with a newly manufactured part is clearly restoration.

The difference of the terms between cleaning and restoration is not so important, but what is important is disclosing replaced parts when something is sold, especially if not an original part. We see a lot of wrong replacement parts in the collecting world. Many of these were done by users for angling purposes, but some were done by errant collectors.

You may want to consider picking up a copy of the ORCA Cleaning, Restoring and Repairing Antique Fishing Reels on the store at https://www.orcaonline.org/orca-store/o ... ing-reels/.

[klonder]

Cleaning:


Restoration:

[Paul Roberts]

Good description, Matt. And good descriptive photos, Klonder.

I’ve come to add a third term, using “refurbishment” for what I do with often worn or damaged reels to get them back to functioning at a proper level for fishing purposes; A step between cleaning and full restoration to original form, and that may involve some creative shimming or parts tweaking or swapping. I don't mind adding additional parts to the schematic if it will get a reel back up to snuff function-wise. I also will not hesitate (very long) to "customize" a reel for aesthetic purposes. I would not do such things to a valuable historical object however. That's the place for true restoration, and best done by those with the knowledge and skills.

[Steve]

Restoration:
Britannica: 1. the act or process of returning something to its original condition by repairing it, cleaning it, etc.

Cambridge: the act or process of returning something to its earlier good condition or position, or to its owner:

Merriam-Webster: 1 : an act of restoring or the condition of being restored: such as
a: a bringing back to a former position or condition
c: a restoring to an unimpaired or improved condition

IMHO, cleaning may be a facet of restoration.

[Sir fishalot]

Thank you everyone for your replies on this subject.
Im new to collecting reels. I have some that need nothing. I have some that need to be serviced.
I have some that need parts. All I believe are salvageable, but, how far does a person go on a reel that might not have much value.
It’s kind of like restoring a cheep car from the 80’s
The restoration costs about 50 thousand and the finished product has a resale value of 15 thousand.
Thank you. Mike

[40fordflathead]

Your last question might be based on how much you personally like the reel. If the reel is important to you, ie your fathers reel cost might not matter.

[Paul Roberts]

Value is in the eye of the beholder(s): personal memories, nostalgia, mechanics, challenge, historical interest, monetary investment, ... . For me, it's a bit of all of it, excepting monetary value. That is, I got into this looking for some cool old reels to fish with. Monetarily I will not likely break even on my outlay. This does not even include my tools, time and energy. We put the value on our interests.

Where outside interests enter in, as I see it, is some responsibility to the historical value of antiquities, not to mention the potential for degrading the monetary value of such an item. It would be a shame in my mind to alter, or damage, a rare fine reel. On the flip-side, I've had both positive and some contrary responses to alterations/customizations I've made to common reels. Not surprisingly, I've tread on some of the value categories listed above for others.

Below is my original intent at "value"; Although I've strayed some, into other categories, since starting this journey. Bottom line? Enjoy these cool old, often forgotten, works of mechanical science and artistry. Follow your bliss.

Late 40's Coxe 95C (only alterations are hockey tape on the grips and felt pads under end caps):

1960's Shakespeare 2062 (re-paint krinkle black, leather bail stop to quiet that 'guillotine' bail):

Late 50's Langley/A&F 200/6 (As a back-reeler I plucked the full-time anti-reverse dog; Would be replaced if sold, but I'm keeping her!):

[Midway Tommy D]

I'm pretty much a purist at heart.

I don't think a collectable reel should be molested, repainted, etc., but there's a point where basic cleaning, service and maintenance kicks in. What good is any tool or item that doesn't function at its optimum capacity or as originally designed? If the brakes on your car were worn out would anyone just keep driving it around or park it just to look at? I think not. I see absolutely nothing wrong with repairing or replacing worn out parts on any reel, and if parts are no longer available I don't think there is anything wrong with fabricating one. To me that is only good stewardship.

[Sir fishalot]

Like I mentioned in earlier posts.
I am new to collecting fishing collectibles.
Im as green as the grass.
I recently purchased a collection from a friend’s spouse. There is so much stuff it’s overwhelming.
My friend's name was John Shoffner. He was a member of orca so some of the older members might remember him.
He always mentioned what a great group of people the members of orca are. He was not kidding.
I thank you all for you kindness and patience.
Thank you. Mike

[Eric J]

If I have a nice old reel that has buggered-up screw heads or end caps and have genuine replacement parts available (I buy all the old Shakespeare dealer parts boxes I find) I will replace the messed-up part every time without worrying about it not being the “original” part, or feeling compelled to disclose that I replaced a messed up part with a correct but nicer part. I cannot imagine anyone thinking they got swindled because I swapped a messed up part with a good one. However, if I had replaced a broken part with one that I had made, or with a non-genuine replacement part I would disclose it so it doesn’t cloud up the historical context for the reel in the future.

[Steve]

My friend's name was John Shoffner.

Mike, John was one of the best. He was a veteran collector by the time I started, and he knew everything there was to know about the hobby. I was always grateful that he was willing to come so far to so many of our eastern shows and spread his knowledge and good humor wherever he went. Though we hadn't seen each other for years, I was deeply saddened to hear of his passing.

[Paul9591]

In reference to whether you should or shouldn't restore, here's how I have personally approached the restoration thing, as a fisherman and a reel collector.

My collecting started with nostagia for the reels I owned as a teen and those I could not afford at the time; also inspired by finding my dad's long lost old half bail Mitchell.

I ended up restoring his reel. It had a lot of paint missing and the handle had been broken off (probably by me) many years ago. Initially, I was just going to replace the broken parts, but as I had had some success from a previous restoration (a low value tired 70's Mitchell 300), I decided to refinish my dad's old reel (he would have approved I think?).

It looked great when it was finished (to me anyway).

That reel got me into collecting those early models (and many other types).
Naturally, I would only spend good money on clean factory original examples, but I later got three other early reels (for pennies!) that were pretty beat up, so I refinished those also.

During my search for spare parts, I managed to collect a second version rotor assembly (identifiable by the indent in the casting by the bail trip lever, and the crude spring), a gear plate with a round AR knob and original gear set (brass insert on the transfer gear), it also came with the body, but someone had butchered the foot, so I used another second version half bail body I got with a box of parts, plus a very early spool. I ended up with a complete era correct second version reel, but again (for me) it needed a full restoration, so I refinished it.
It won't fetch top dollar on resale, but then again it was previously only a box of bits (resale value doesn't worry me anyway).

I also have another second version reel which to the best of my knowledge, is all factory original, and that's how it will stay.

The collector in me wants factory original reels, and most of mine are at the very least least period correct, but I do get a lot of pleasure from returning the less tidy examples back to as close to new as possible.

Pictured is my 'parts' reel:

[klonder]

Whether a good cleaning or full blown resto, I find it's the process that's most satisfying.
As to $s, who cares, you'll never recover the worth of you time and effort in $s, but taking a $5 reel like the second reel in my earlier post and bringing it back from the dead is most satisfying and always a learning experience.
Cheers

[Paul Roberts]

Well done, Paul. Beautiful reel. Heck, I'm proud of that reel too! And it's not even mine. Thanks for sharing it.

[Paul9591]

Well done, Paul. Beautiful reel. Heck, I'm proud of that reel too! And it's not even mine. Thanks for sharing it.

Thank you Paul, it took some time sourcing the parts, but as klonder pointed out, it was a very enjoyable and satisfying journey to the final result.

[Eric J]

Great work Paul! It’s obvious you gained a lot of knowledge by dissecting and rebuilding those reels, and ORCA needs experts like you to share that knowledge. You’ve turned a box full of parts into a very handsome and fishable reel.

[Sir fishalot]

Ok everyone,
Being new to collecting reels i was a little skeptical about restoring some of the reels i have.
But seeing these pictures, and the care that was taken to bring some of these pieces back to their former glory. I think thats cool.
I guess i didn’t really think about the personal gratification one might get making that first cast with a cool old reel. And then to catch a fish with that reel. Yeah.
Time to order the reel repair and restoration and maintenance book from the orca store.

[klonder]

And get yourself the best set of quality, hollow ground point screwdrivers you can afford. Gunsmithing type/size. Some of the screw slots are way skinny and good tools make for good results.

[Paul Roberts]

Ditto that.

[Paul9591]

Great work Paul! It’s obvious you gained a lot of knowledge by dissecting and rebuilding those reels, and ORCA needs experts like you to share that knowledge. You’ve turned a box full of parts into a very handsome and fishable reel.

Thank you Eric J,

Research, preparation, patience and a dose of good luck is the secret to a successful restoration project.

I have certainly had some heartbreaks along the way (paint runs, blooms, bubble holes, over sanding back to metal, slippages with the etching tool and many more, but you just have to pick yourself up off the floor and start again. Another major factor for me was the help I got from fellow forum members, who kindly shared their experiences with me (and sometimes sent me parts and literature free of charge; that is a real kindness from a fellow enthusiast you have never met in person), and if I have inspired others to restore their old reels, then that is an added bonus for me.

Happy cleaning/restoring everyone!

[Paul9591]

Deep clean or restoration? Probably both.

I did straighten out the twisted reel foot I suppose:

[Paul Roberts]

Deep clean or restoration? Probably both.

I did straighten out the twisted reel foot I suppose:

Maybe both! Lovely. Neat seeing that reel as it probably looked new -to my untrained eyes anyway.

[Paul9591]

Deep clean or restoration? Probably both.

I did straighten out the twisted reel foot I suppose:

Maybe both! Lovely. Neat seeing that reel as it probably looked new -to my untrained eyes anyway.

Thanks Paul,

This little reel (Portage Seminole 40) was a joy to work on, simply because it could be completely disassembled.