Penn 109 49 Spool

[bassmagnum]

So recently I was looking at one of my Penn 49s that had always given me a question mark. The spool is black just like my plastic ones, but it just didn't feel right. I finally pulled it apart and was surprised to see what appeared to be a Newell spool with Penn numbers but the old line on it looked like 50's/60's. I found out from a friend that it was a Penn spool and that there was another spool with just the 49a on it. So far that's been all I've been able to find out, but I know there are some extremely knowledgeable people here that probably know all about it. I'd love to know more about it seeing as it's one I'm not familiar with. Thanks
Ross

[1badf350]

Probably a 49L with aluminum spool.

[bassmagnum]

Thanks Chris but this is a factory-made graphite spool. If I had more than minimum computer skills I would have posted a picture
Ross

[1badf350]

Ross I’ve studied Penn reels for about 10 years now. Penn never made a graphite spool 49, but I can see where the coating on the aluminum spool could resemble graphite.
Maybe you have an aftermarket spool?
Without seeing and holding it, that’s all I got. Will be interesting to see it

[bassmagnum]

I did it . I’ll just have to use my phone when I want to add photos. Here’s a couple of pictures Chris. It’s identical to Newell spools except that Carl always had his initials, CN, on both sides of the spool.
Could it be black anodized aluminum? It sure feels like graphite though. What is really throwing me is the line on the spool as it looks like it’s 50/60’s lead core
The more I think about it and exam it, it appears to have been made from a casting and not machined. I really don't want to, but I might just have to pull the line off it and see what's under there.
Ross

[oc1]

There was a 109PS and 109MS. 'PS' for plastic spool, 'MS' for metal spool. Then later they changed it to just 109M and 109P. They marked it on the box, but not on the reel itself.

Gouge it with a penknife inside the flange where it won't show. That will tell you what it's made of.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/226153774176?i ... SwwuRmSqpK

https://www.ebay.com/itm/395494026819?i ... Sw~7hmT7nw

https://www.ebay.com/itm/266855433229?i ... SwLtFmaLAz

[bassmagnum]

Thanks, oc1 but the 109 number is part of my confusion. Spool says 109 49 and it came out of 49 Super Mariner and it's definitely made of metal. I did what you suggested, and the spool is black under the test area. Unfortunately, no matter I what try I'm not skilled enough with a computer to get photos here
Ross

[1badf350]

Are we talking about a model 109 or a model 49 reel?
Without seeing the markings are you sure it doesn’t say 29-49 or 29L-49?
The 29 is the standard Penn part number for spools. The 49 would be the reel model

Check this link and tell me if that’s your spool
https://www.mysticparts.com/PennParts/Parts/29L-49.aspx

[bassmagnum]

Maybe I got it this time

[bassmagnum]

Thanks for the time and effort Chris but that's not it. I called Mystic but they didn't answer and I'm waiting a return call from Penn. Just tried again using my phone but doesn't appear that I got it
Ross
Pictures didn't come. Time for me to walk away before the frustration heightens

[1badf350]

Can you email me pictures? I will send you a private message with my email address

[bassmagnum]

Good morning, Chris. That I can do
Ross

[Leonard R. Finch]

Thanks, oc1 but the 109 number is part of my confusion. Spool says 109 49 and it came out of 49 Super Mariner and it's definitely made of metal. I did what you suggested, and the spool is black under the test area. Unfortunately, no matter I what try I'm not skilled enough with a computer to get photos here
Ross

IF the area is black where you scratched it then it is plastic or Graphite .If it WERE Metal (Aluminum) it would be shiny silverish.
Newell made Kits for the 349 with bars ,spools,rod clamps and feet I KNOW as I have several and most likely made spools for the others .

[bassmagnum]

Thanks Leonard. It certainly seems to be graphite but the 2 things throwing me is what appears to be lead core line from days gone by and the lack of Carl Newell's initials on the spool. Every Newell spool I have has CN on the inside of both flanges. Maybe the initials weren't on all of his spools but if the spools are cast wouldn't they be? We'll figure it out sooner or later. Thanks again
Ross

[Leonard R. Finch]

Most of the NEWELL Metal Spools I have seen all have CN on them like you posted .
Not so sure about the Graphite .
You should take a Needle and heat it up on the stove and see if it melts into the inner side of it as I think you prob have a Plastic Spool and it is factory PENN just seems different with the Heavy Line on it .
Also as mentioned detailed picture would help immensely and or Weight of the empty Spool .

[bassmagnum]

Good morning, Leonard. Using a hot needle is a great idea, thanks. Really trying to avoid taking the line off, if possible, as sometimes it adds to the, for lack of better word, the aura of the reel. I may not have a choice. If the reel didn't look so new it would be easier to determine if it was vintage or not. Thanks again
Ross

[1badf350]

Mystery solved. Its definitely an aluminum 49L spool
Ross your picture of the spool showed a part number 1091.49 on the inside spool flange.

I found the same part number on a brand new aluminum spool. Here is the picture of that spool

[m3040c]

Seems to be a lot of confusion here. I am confused, maybe, I think, but not really. Maybe this will help.

First, I want to say, I will be mentioning the Penn 49 plastic spools. They were used over 30 years on the tall trolling reels and there was an evolution of their base material and structure. Originally, they were Black Bakelite. The inside head plate side of the spool was originally a plain flat flange. Over time, that was improved on, probably because fisherman started using these Lightweight spool reels for casting to very large fish and the plain, flat flange was not strong enough to stand up to fish like Yellowfin fin tuna. The older and weaker spool is on the left in this photo:


The tail plate side of the old spool did have some structure, that structure was nowhere near what the new and improved Bakelite spool had though.


When Penn upgraded the structure of the spool, they also upgraded the material, but not with graphite. Penn added fiberglass to the base material to bring up its material strength and help with the brittle effect you get with Bakelite. Spools came with a sticker on the arbor that faded quickly but if you find an old clean box, you will see the sticker on the box also.


I feel the need for extra strength needed for the spool was created by the Penn Export versions that were being used in South Africa. That is where fisherman were using Penn 49's for casting from the shore to large game fish.

Hope this helps. These spools were upgraded to the newer versions ini the 1960's, I believe.

[m3040c]

Iin reference to the 109PS meaning "Plastic Spool" and 109MS meaning "Metal Spool", that is wrong. First, I have never seen any 109 with a "PS" following the model number. So, I have nothing for that interpretation. In reference to the 109MS, the initial, "M"= Metal Spool, while the "S"= Saltwater Stand. "MS" does not mean Metal Spool.

[Leonard R. Finch]

I feel the need for extra strength needed for the spool was created by the Penn Export versions that were being used in South Africa. That is where fisherman were using Penn 49's for casting from the shore to large game fish.

Hope this helps. These spools were upgraded to the newer versions ini the 1960's, I believe.

While we are on the 49ers The African Model was a 49A Super Mariner and was WIDER .

[1badf350]

I think the confusion lies in the number 1091.49 stamped on the aluminum 29L-49 spool.
Ross thought it said 109-49 because the second 1 is hard to read. So we were never really talking about a model 109.
Having now seen the picture of Ross’s reel, i defer back to my original post that it is simply an aluminum 49L spool

[bassmagnum]

First off thank you Chris, Leonard and Mike
Chris, you got it, that's the spool. They really did a great job of anodizing it black. I used a sharp nut pick and scratched fairly heavily in a discreet location and never struck silver. There's no arguing your pictures

Leonard, that widened 49 your talking about sounds very much like a Frankenstein 349H that I have

Mike, thanks for all that info. I grew up fishing nothing but Penn reels and until now, like many others, thought MS was metal spool.

I think that wraps up my inquiry into this. Thank you everyone. Now I can determine an age on the reel much better
Ross

[m3040c]

Leonard, that widened 49 your talking about sounds very much like a Frankenstein 349H that I have

The Penn 49A pre-dates the existence of any 349. The wide 349 you mention is loving called, "The Wahoo Special", and it created by using a Carl Newell kit.

The 49A has a very rich history begun in South Africa after WW II. They are sought after in this country and also in South Africa, where they are much easier to find than in the USA. Many cosmetic variations exist for the 49A. Here are a few:

[Leonard R. Finch]

Mike ,your picture of the 49 Reel with the actual A on the Plate is not so common ..

[m3040c]

[Mike ,your pic with the A on the Plate is NEAT . I don't have one with it but have some boxes with the A and mentions the Fiberglass infused Spool./quote]

Penn exported to South Africa for decades. The only reel ever marked with the "A" was the first issue of the wide Penn 49A.




After the first run of "A" marked reels, the marking was only on the box. All the other South African models were only marked on the box also. Very hard to find "A" marked reels today.

Penn did send many of their models to South Africa and only marked the boxes. No other Penn reel was altered, only the model 49.





They are an interesting addition to a Penn collection.