NOS Penn 712Z Spinfisher

[Araye50]

New old stock Penn 712Z spinning reel. Black & gold anodized, in bubble package, approximately 10 years old. Asking $125 plus s/h.

[SWIM JIG]

usa , your reel is a fresh water reel 1976 issue , not that hard to find in OHIO tackle dealers shelfs as a new reel old stock, they didnt sell that well and still list at $59.99 in wrights reel book at that price! reason the didnt sell well was people could get the Salt water version for just a tad more in cost thus when the snow birds went south to florida, they only needed one reel! I still have droves of new old stock parts for them and so does the ROD MAKERS SHOP in Strongsville OHIO! Good luck on your sale, you most likly would do beter trading it for a antique or other reel! Col. Milton lorens aka swim jig of amherst ohio

[Araye50]

Not sure how you define "1976 issue" however I purchased the Penn 712Z new/retail in 1999. Weren't the '76 versions black spool w/o gold anodize?

your reel is a fresh water reel 1976 issue

IMO the 712Z appears to be every bit as salt resistant as the 704Z, thus equally suited to salt water use. I fish SW exclusively here in FL & virtually no other inshore anglers I see use anything as big as the 704Z, most use gear that's less capable than the 712Z.

I'd thought the 712Z was out of production for quite a few years. Only the 704Z & 706Z were listed, but not illustrated, in '05 Penn catalog. A funny thing about published list prices is that an old list price will always be the old list price.

What does Wright list the 704Z & 706Z at? Perhaps I'd get some bites asking $100 plus s/h for the NOS 712Z?

[SWIM JIG]

usa Lets clear a few things, true you as the end user and your knowledge of how to take care of you reel most likly a fresh water reel will work on you in salt water! however to keep a warrenty valid etc from the mfg, it must say salt water use or if a fresh water reel is used in salt water the warrenty is generaly voided! Some dealers , if the owner of the reel is a excelent customer will repair the reel however the factory wont! the differace is mainly the gears , and screws etc, all these items will withstand salt water on a salt water reel, also they will stand fresh water use! Not so on a fresh water reel used in salt water! You do as you want with your reels, they are yours! As for new old stock reels, dealers around OHIO and Michigan and PENN. still have new old stock reels for sale! Mike Wohlever buys out not only dealers however actual distributors of old stock new reels! This area is a treasur chest of these kinds of reels, be it PENNS ZEBCOS, PFLUGERS , shakespers etc! The MFGs will not take old stock back most of the time only the distributors will on certain ITEMS! The thing is would you buy a 3 year old car off the lot for its suggested retail price? and belive this! 2006s &07s are plentiful in this area ! ARAYE50, As for a collector needing your reel , time becomes money and most likly a collector will buy it for your price rather than to spend weeks or months on the phone hunting a like reel! I just pulled a new old stock 711-L off my shelf, main gear is Stainless, driving gear is Phospher Bronze I got it from a dealer for his cost of $42.77 no tax! Col. Milton lorens aka swim jig of ohio

[Araye50]

That's an interesting distinction: "to keep a warrenty valid etc from the mfg, it must say salt water use or if a fresh water reel is used in salt water the warrenty is generaly voided!"

Since the 712Z was sitting within arm's reach I took a look for you. The Penn Reels SERIES Z manual SPECIFICATIONS page indicates another interesting distinction. Every Z model is listed for either "fresh and salt" on smaller models, or "salt and fresh" on larger ones. The 712Z (& 713Z) are the last listed "salt and fresh". The warranty information printed on the bubble pack card, in the manual & the seperate warranty page make no mention of salt water use voiding a warranty.

I find no indication Penn restricted 712Z warranty exclusively as "a fresh water reel 1976 issue" & clear indications it was designed & intended for "salt and fresh" water use. Also noticed the manual is date stamped Oct 18, 1997. Of course I believe issues related to a "one year from date of purchase" mfg. warranty are mute on an 11 YO obsolete model sold by an individual, even if its NOS.

Please check your "dealers around OHIO and Michigan and PENN" for NOS 704Z & 706Z reels languishing at the old "suggested retail price" I'd like to buy some. Are your dealers obligated to warranty obsolete NOS? Those I'm familiar w/discount heavily to sell out discontinued models.

Warranty rarely interests me & I only used warranty once on reels. However, I have benefitted from the practice of replacing defective reels under warranty. My 1st Mitchell 302 came out of a discount bin at JC Penny for cheap nearly 40 years ago! It got tossed in after some small part fell off & they gave the customer a new 1 instead of repair. Picked up the part on the way home, fished w/the 302 that day & still have it.

[Lynn Thomas]

Answering your question of Wrights price on the two reels. Wright's Price Guide,Third Edition, 2002 lists 704 Z at $73.99. The 706 Z lists at $94.99. (He notes that these prices are the current average retail selling price).

[SWIM JIG]

Lets understand a WARRENTY and what its realy is! I, (ezaction products company has been a warrenty center for pover 17 years and the ONLY SERVICE CENTER IN OHIO For OKUMA reels, (they dont have warrenty centers!) As a ZEBCO WARRENTY CENTER, WE are bound to Honor a valid warrenty even if the reel is a older modle and also if parts are avalible I go back many years on parts all the way to the ZERO HR BOMB) as for OKUMA I keep parts for the reels related to our GREAT LAKES AREA! Now As a WARRENTY and Service Center, its our Honest Judgement ( the Companies depend on their warrenty and service centers to keep the end user ie You the owner satified with the product! NOW, (ARAYE50) ie ROB, its Our ability to see if one , did the reel fail to preform as it was designed to do? 2 is the original sales recipt with the reel dated? or in ZEBCOs new policy as of 2008) Reads The selling dealer in a case where the original sales slip is Missing can on their business letterhead and signed by them and dated will sufice for a lost sales slip thus we can be reimbused for our work and parts! As for OKUMA, we do work as long as the reel hasent been abused, ie crushed, or a fresh water reel is salt intruded with, etc! We were a warrenty center for years for DAIWA amd repair center for Shimano and a warrenty center for PFLUGER-SHAKESPERE! As age caiught up with me now over 70 years young, I dropped some work, I never did work for PENN however the Rod makers shop in Strongsville OHIO is a warenty center! They Specilze in PENN and Shiamno, and have other brands! Your thoughts on a new old stock reel being under warrenty is just this! If its new old stock never been sold or used as a demo etc, has the proper paperwork, and valid dated sales slip it will be covered or replaced with a newer modle reel if parts are no longer availble! regardles of the actual date on the reel! REMBER! IT MUST BE FIRST POINT OF SALE & WITH A DATED SALES SLIP THATS LESS THAN ONE YEAR OLD< IE 8 year old reel sold new this date say 13 nov 2008 and goes bad no later than 13 nov 2009 and not been ABUSED, ie salt water intrusion, mis used etc will be covered! also some other terms may be a deciding factor! Its up first(the center , then the MFG) If the reel says not salt water garrenteed , thats what it means! Not your idea of warrenty! Use a reel or abuse it or if it shows signs of being taken apart , dropped and a bent handle , or broken bail arm etc or any misuse will generaly void the warrenty, same as a car, if a motor blows up on a new car and you fail to stop when the check oil lite comes on, then in most cases your warrenty is VOID! Rob, ONE THING To KEEP IN MIND< If parts arenot availible and you send your reel in , you may get a new reel and will get a new reel in its place however they wont send your old collectable reel back to you!It most likly will be destroyed and scrapped! Now if any other member reading this post needs More Imfo on a warrenty center , mail me at EZACTION PRODUCTS COMPANY 759 Terra lane Amherst Ohio 44001-1116-07 atten MILT enclosed a stamped self addresed envelope ) note I will not mail it back if you fail to enclose a stamped envelope Col. Milton lorens aka swim jig of Amherst ohio

[Araye50]

Col. Milt, respectfully "the reel says" nothing. I did not offer my "idea" but merely passed along what Penn published & provided w/the 712Z reel. It was not my "idea" that the manual packed w/the 712Z reel stated it was intended for "salt and fresh" use, it was quoting Penn. I'm sorry that contradicts your claim my "reel is a fresh water reel".

If the reel says not salt water garrenteed , thats what it means! Not your idea of warrenty!

After reading your sermon "Lets understand a WARRENTY" I'm so glad I haven't bought a new reel in nearly a decade. As I said, its all mute anyway b/c I bought the 712Z in '99 & had no expectation, nor did I make any inquiry about anyone honoring the 1 year warranty. It is not & never was an issue for me.

Good to know dealers are expected to do something for obsolete NOS reel warrantys. Actually heard someone boast, Shimano would send a new reel to replace any POS Shimano he found at the fleamarket! Thanks for the warning: "If parts arenot availible and you send your reel in , you may get a new reel and will get a new reel in its place however they wont send your old collectable reel back to you!It most likly will be destroyed and scrapped!" Might enjoy prospecting their dumpster some days.

[SWIM JIG]

jump usa , When ZEBCO was cranking out the NEW REELS of THE TIME, warrenty problems took time! Clint Beeler sr. now deceased was in managment at the time and the company wondered how to save money on Warrent work, Well clint sr. told them that would be eazy to do, and he waliked out to the plant workshop with his coffee cup in had, he then picked up a rather large hammer, came back into the management meeting room, and said give me one of those reels that need wareenty work done on it! one member of the team handed hoim a reel , he laid it on the table raised up the hammer and smacked the reel into pices, the people recomposed themselfs and clint said PROBLEM Solved , send the person a NEW REEL! as labor cost money! Thats how it actualy was done on the low dollar reels, labor to do one reel would be more than (and I hope i stiil got the #s right) 4 new reels would cost to send back to the owners! PROBLEM SOLVED! As for the dump bins, well people would come after the plant and office were closed for the day and DIVE in the Dumpsters for reels! Then ZEBCO in a area knowen to a few select and trusted employees would take the busted reels and bury them! I belive Mary Beard knows about the site, and shes not telling, not even to ME! HA HA! And other Companies did the same and still do that to this day! Its the only way to be cost effective! Thats why they also have warrenty centers as we are our own business and can do the work less than the factory can do it! Col. milton lorens aka swim jig of OHIO

[Araye50]

IMO this kind of institutionalized waste is sacrilegous. Considerably worse than the cost effectiveness of designed obsolesence.

clint sr. told them that would be eazy to do, and he waliked out to the plant workshop with his coffee cup in had, he then picked up a rather large hammer, came back into the management meeting room, and said give me one of those reels that need wareenty work done on it! one member of the team handed hoim a reel , he laid it on the table raised up the hammer and smacked the reel into pices

As for the dump bins, well people would come after the plant and office were closed for the day and DIVE in the Dumpsters for reels! Then ZEBCO in a area knowen to a few select and trusted employees would take the busted reels and bury them!

And other Companies did the same and still do that to this day!

Unfortunately its rewarded by our regressive tax codes that encourage companys to take profits through losses. The practice is popular w/auto makers as well. This year there will be a maximum number of new vehicles destroyed as losses for tax purposes. Most will have no defects whatsoever. The obscene part is that the manufacturers may end up earning more from declaring the loss than they'd have gotten if the vehicles were sold through dealerships. The sick part is the millions of old vehicles in unsafe condition on the road while new ones are crushed. What makes me mad is all the millions of hours/dollars poor folks spend trying to keep rusty worn out junk running.

In a more perfect world "clint sr." might have studied all returned reels to analyize the nature/frequency of defects in pursuit of perfecting the products. Of course its not "cost effective" to sell products that last too long either.