Red Penn Delmar 285

ReelMan1988 · Post by **ReelMan1988** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 9:30 pm

I just purchased this Penn Delmar 285 through eBay by Best offer of $180, it was pretty battered up but I saved it. New old stock from a same year Delmar brings this one to Like New!

What do you think?

Mike? If I had that Penn 85 Red one I'd have a set!

m3040c · Post by **m3040c** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 1:00 am

Nice reel. I was the other bidder when the seller dumped his ad his ad because of your back door offer. Unethical business practices in my opinion but there is a lot of that going around these days.

Enjoy the reel.

kingfisher · Post by **kingfisher** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 4:43 am

Hello John,

You did a good job in bringing this unusual coloured reel back to as new condition. Well done.

I was watching that reel as well . It and a 1938 Penn 100 yard Long Beach I'd bid on disappeared overnight. I suspected that a deal was done. Did you get the Long Beach as well?
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll ... 0382353675
If you did then the box is not old enough and the catalog should be a # 8 not a # 15 so I hope your offer was not too much.

Ray

ReelMan1988 · Post by **ReelMan1988** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 7:56 am

No, he needed some quick cash so he didn't hesitate to sell.

http://cgi.ebay.com/RARE-Penn-Long-Beac ... dZViewItem

I didn't buy the Long Beach, he took it off because He asked me how much he could get for it. I estimated $100 - $150? So he slapped it on for $125 Buy It Now.

I'm Very Very sorry if anyone is mad at me for buying it. I asked him if he'd put a Buy It Now and he just took it off and requested Paypal.

I've done business with him several times before so he gave me the First Chance to get it. I thought $180 was Fair.

Mike! Next one is yours.

You did beat me on that Penn 85 Multicolored! I'd still like to own that one!

1949modphil · Post by **1949modphil** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 8:47 am

I had a comment for you Mike, but I put it in the wrong place. I totally agree with your sentiments about back door deals. All to many times, I'm watching a reel and it disappears, with the lame excuse that the item was lost or broken. It just ain't fair. I wasn't born with money, spent 23 years in the Army 3 combat tours, and worked hard to get what I have today. and that ain't much. I don't want all the reels, just 1 of each. I've noticed some folks buy reels like they won the lottery, price is no object. Thats great for them but tough for people like me who still have to budget everday just to live comfortably. Forgive me, I just had to vent.

1949modphil · Post by **1949modphil** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 8:52 am

I got a multi-colored 85 for sale. $1,000,000. Any takers

ReelMan1988 · Post by **ReelMan1988** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 9:07 am

Well it is a nice reel! I'm just glad to have one like it.

BAP-62 · Post by **BAP-62** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 10:03 am

What year was this reel made?

m3040c · Post by **m3040c** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 11:18 am

Yes Phil, go ahead and vent.

As John basically says, first money wins and that is OK. Of course I do not agree (EBay is a auction atmosphere and in theory, LAST money should win) but I understand. In this particular case, it is the seller that is at fault. The seller ended the auction, sold the item to John without listing it with a Buy It Now at John's offer. So EBay gets cheated out of their New Listing Fee and Final Value Fee. It is impossible to stop people that have big dollars from overbidding and it is also impossible to stop buyers from making offers to end auctions early. It is up to the sellers to do things within the rules of EBay. This seller is 100% wrong and I have reported him, John is only wrong ethically by going around corners and making offers to tempt sellers to do the wrong thing (you know, like Eve did to Adam with the apple).

My problem with this is, I see it happening more and more and I know in the long run it will, if left unchecked, create a market on EBay that has no rules. That would be too bad because I see EBay as a unique creation that brings the auction world to the common man's house on a daily basis. It enables me to do business from home easily and I like it that way.

Yes John, it makes me mad

when I see unethical business anywhere. Doing business honestly is what creates a atmosphere of longevity in business. I did outbid you on that multi colored 85 but I outbid you at auction, not by going behind the scenes and making the seller a back door offer. I think that makes a difference.

Jerry J in OK · Post by **Jerry J in OK** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 11:40 am

I was not involved in this auction but back-door deals make me sick. As a seller, I report those who make me offers or ask me to end auctions early. Maybe if those of us who use ebay frequently report the abousers more often they wll be weeded out.

If someone needs money quick, they should use Buy It Now instead of auction style. There is no excuse for the back door dealing.

Jerry

BAP-62 · Post by **BAP-62** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 11:59 am

Jerry
I feel eBay is part of the problem. I had a case that a person ( who I will not name ) was running up my bid with no intent to buy the item. I talked to many people at eBay as well as on here, they all agreed with me. In the end eBay did NOTHING. That person is still on eBay playing his games.

m3040c · Post by **m3040c** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 12:38 pm

BTW, John, the reel you created by changing all the parts to mint is now obviously pretty but wrong for its vintage. The handle, free spool lever, left spool bearing and stand are too modern for the late 1940's vintage of the reel. But it is pretty.

fishbugman · Post by **fishbugman** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 12:40 pm

I have some camembert and brie to go with all the whine about back door deals. Some people cannot afford to bid way over the top for a fishing reel, but still want it. Asking the seller how much they want for the reel on a buy-it-now usually ends up in a "we are going to let the auction run its course" response, but sometimes not. If the seller comes back with a price and your agree, as a buyer you are taking a big risk if the deal is done OFF-THE-BOARD as you will have no resolve thru EBAY if the seller just ends the auction. However, if the seller and you agree on a price and it is done thru a BUY-IT-NOW no one has the right to complain. I recently asked about a buy-it-now price on a reel lot and was told $35 shipped. I responded very fairly with a response of "If you place it on EBAY Buy-It-Now I will give you $50 plus shipping." The seller did and for about 2 seconds it was there for anyone to buy-it-now. I lucked out an got the bid in first and know the reel has already been shipped.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0319041327

Call it backdoor or whatever you want, but I feel I got my moneys worth and the seller got more than they wanted, so all relevant parties are happy.

m3040c · Post by **m3040c** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 12:41 pm

Also, John, because this reel is probably a 1946 vintage, there should be no part numbers on any of the metal parts.

m3040c · Post by **m3040c** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 1:05 pm

Fishbugman,

Yours was done in a way that seems more correct as long as no bids were placed on the item. That is where the ethics come in, in my opinion. If there is a bid in place on the item, then the auction has begun and should not be allowed to end early unless stated so in the description. Everyone was happy in your deal because no one got pushed aside because of your offer, I presume. Also, EBay was properly paid for the use of their Buy It Now service.

What we are talking about here (not whining about) with this Delmar was not done correctly. The item had a bid in place, so it should not have been ended unless the bidder placed the listing in that manner and it was sold without a Buy It Now. That is just wrong.

Jerry J in OK · Post by **Jerry J in OK** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 2:00 pm

I should have been more specific before. I was responding to the scenario of the item already having a bid. I agree that ebay has to be willing to take action on policy violators. I will keep reporting them and, maybe, if enough reports are finally received they may actually take some sort of action.

Asking someone to make the item a Buy It Now before any bids does not help the potential bidders that have it on their watch list. Guyess it is their hard luck for going by the rules. It reminds me of being at a show or flea market and dealing with someone on a reel or whatever and having someone else walk up and shoot a high offer and buying the item out from under you. It has happened to me and really burned me up.

Nice discussion. No disrespect intended, just expressing my opinion.

Jerry

fishbugman · Post by **fishbugman** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 2:14 pm

m3040c wrote:
Yes John, it makes me mad
when I see unethical business anywhere.

Sorry about the "Whine" comment...there is a related thread about items pulled from EBAY early or sold direct without letting the auction run its course and maybe, that comment will snuff the whine before it starts again.

Business today is a new beast. A business doesn't have to be ethical, honest, moral, have a good business plan, show good intent or even make money to qualify for free money handouts. Call it a loan, like they do, but if no money is made no loan can be repaid and to get in the mess the banking industry and car companies are in they had to lose more money than they made. The good, honest, ethical Mom & Pops shops of all types certainly are not going to get the free handout of money, so they must not be a good thing. EBAY never got a handle on shill bidding, because to them the increased income of the higher bidding was a case of dishonesty paying off...it made them more money. The case of them getting cut out of a deal is more prevalent now since they cannot control the sniper bidding systems...one person bids to open and then the majority of items sit there at .99 cents or $9.99 with one bid until the last hour of auction when all the snipe bids hit. A prudent seller with the lack of knowledge of item value is much more apt to jump at an offer after seeing the item sit for 2-4 days with no activity. EBAY asks the seller why with a multiple choice option, something like A) item damaged B) item no longer available or C) other and has no way to know if the item was sold direct. You try to be good, but it really pays to be bad sometimes.

1949modphil · Post by **1949modphil** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 2:20 pm

Ethics be #%[at]*^. They have gone the way of the handshake that used to be your bond.

I wouldn't know if a reel was completely original if it could talk to me, but I'm learning still reading some fine discussions. Thanks

m3040c · Post by **m3040c** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 3:21 pm

Well maybe I am old fashioned but I still believe in ethics and a handshake. To me they are still important. I find the majority of people do not disappoint me. Sure we have to protect ourselves when dealing with strangers and I get that old feeling of distrust from people I do not know all the time but a few clean deals usually wins them over and a few and far between unethical deals roots out the ones I do not want to do business with. Our current economic environment is a example of large, unethical short term gains for few and a disaster for all in the long run.

ReelMan1988 · Post by **ReelMan1988** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 3:47 pm

I know the handle is different and the lever. I'm obtaining an older version. This is just for now.

1949modphil · Post by **1949modphil** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:02 pm

Mike, I didn't mean I didn't think most are people without ethics. As far as ebay goes, alot of the sellers and buyers have thrown their ethics out the window with the wash water. There ain't nobody more old-fashioned than me and I wish times would return when a mans word was his bond. But nowadays, we are not a trusting society, with just cause. The Madoffs and other naredowells have made alot of people leary of trusting of anyone but close friends. I can well remember the days when we never bothered to lock our house or let us kids play anywhere in the neighborhood without worries. Oh how I long for the good old days. Regards, Phil

Reel Geezer · Post by **Reel Geezer** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:09 pm

Apparently no one looked at the middle reel fishbugman bought. I would think you would be a bit embarrassed! A $50 offer on a $500 to $1000 Gayle reel doesn't seem like something an ethical person would say is fair. That's why we have auctions - so that those people who have no idea what they have don't get completely screwed.

fishbugman · Post by **fishbugman** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:35 pm

Not embarassed at all on this end. For one, the reel is a beater and might only be a parts reel from the looks of it. Luckily, I do have some parts for those. For two, the seller didn't ask me what I would be willing to pay for the reels, but offered the reels to me at $35 shipped and I responded by offering $50 plus shipping. He who speaks first loses. Yes, I would have offered substantially more. For three, it was done legitimately thru the buy-it-now and the entire world had the opportunity to buy-it-now at $50 and I was first one to pull the trigger.

I know you can't be insinuating that you have paid full price on every reel you have ever bought or that after buying a box of reels for $10 apiece you found a $500 reel in the mix and went back to give the seller his other $490. A good deal is one where both the buyer and seller are happy at the end of the transaction and that was the case with this deal.

ReelMan1988 · Post by **ReelMan1988** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:53 pm

Couldn't have said it better bugman!

BAP-62 · Post by **BAP-62** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:56 pm

LOL

That was great. Looks like we have more than one person in here that will do whatever it takes to get something they want. I guess they play by the moto " screw anyone I can ". I know a lot of you think that I'm crazy for paying what I do for many of the reals I buy. At least I do it up front. I have collected many things over the years and have seen this in all of them. When it comes to money there many people that just don't care what they do, as long as they come out ahead. They use all kinds of reasons for what they do, I'm young, I didn't know, etc. A lot have values so low that they don't have a clue that what they are doing is wrong. All you can do is ignore them.

Red Penn Delmar 285

Red Penn Delmar 285

????????????????

Multi-colored 85

Checks on ebay

Apologies, Mike