Hello, I'd like to see if I could get some info on the reel, year made, value, ect. It's a Redifor Warren O., Beetzsel, there is no marks on the foot so I'm not sure how many yards it can hold. If the pictures work for me than the reel is really nicer than the pics. if there are no picture than I'd say the reel is better than 8. I'm not a reel person and would like to trade it for a creek chub or boxed misc. lure of the same value, thanks. Mike Campouris
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Redifor, Beetzsel
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john elder
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Hey, Mike: I don't know about the history of this reel...hopefully, some of the smart guyz here can give you some specifics. However, Stu Lawson's book lists several, with a high for the "first model exib at $875...most are averaging appr. $350. I believe yours has three patent dates? One listed has two..don't know about the rest. One of the listings indicated "Pflueger", but don't know that there is a connection with Pfl. Nice reel! Wish I had a painted stick that would work in trade!
Read about this somewhere
I seem to remember an article done on the reel but can't remember where. A quick look thru the ORCA back issue index and Phil's index of the NFLCC G*bass*ette by John didn't find anything. Anybody else remember something on this subject?
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john elder
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- Joined: Mon Sep 22, 2003 2:44 pm
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john elder
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- Joined: Mon Sep 22, 2003 2:44 pm
I believe that's Savu, Harvey...but surely that's not important now...and stop calling me shirley.
geeez, I hate homework...in any event, Brian tracked down the really nice article from Reel News of Spring, 1998 and an article written by Frank Stewart...nice job, Frank!
Evidence indicates that the Redifor Rod and Reel Co. of Warren, Ohio was in existence from around 1904-1920, in various forms. A sell-out to Pflueger occurred around 1910 and by 1915, the reel had morphed into the Pflueger Redifor...supposition is that Pfl was making the reel for Redifor and basically took it over when patents were acquired. A patent was applied for the Beetzsel level wind in 1914, by the original owner, George Upton and the inventor, Benjamin Flegel...apparently granted in 1918. this was apparently the death throes of involvement of these two gentlemen in the co. and looks like Pfl, shake, and Meisselbach all benefited from the mechanisms originally developed at Redifor. Lots of interesting suppositions and side-bars in the article and well worth the read. I'm still not clear on whether the co. itself ever made a reel or whether it was all contracted out, based on the article...Flegel was apparently a skilled watchmaker who made all his own reels for his hobby, distance casting, so he presumably brought the main ideas and prototypes to the table.
I'm sure the board mavens could add more detail here. I have done my penance for shooting from the hip once again
geeez, I hate homework...in any event, Brian tracked down the really nice article from Reel News of Spring, 1998 and an article written by Frank Stewart...nice job, Frank!
Evidence indicates that the Redifor Rod and Reel Co. of Warren, Ohio was in existence from around 1904-1920, in various forms. A sell-out to Pflueger occurred around 1910 and by 1915, the reel had morphed into the Pflueger Redifor...supposition is that Pfl was making the reel for Redifor and basically took it over when patents were acquired. A patent was applied for the Beetzsel level wind in 1914, by the original owner, George Upton and the inventor, Benjamin Flegel...apparently granted in 1918. this was apparently the death throes of involvement of these two gentlemen in the co. and looks like Pfl, shake, and Meisselbach all benefited from the mechanisms originally developed at Redifor. Lots of interesting suppositions and side-bars in the article and well worth the read. I'm still not clear on whether the co. itself ever made a reel or whether it was all contracted out, based on the article...Flegel was apparently a skilled watchmaker who made all his own reels for his hobby, distance casting, so he presumably brought the main ideas and prototypes to the table.
I'm sure the board mavens could add more detail here. I have done my penance for shooting from the hip once again
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mc
redifor
Thanks for all the help guy's, I talked to John about the reel and here is a little of the info he gave me. The company was in existence from AROUND 1906 to 1918, the founder was George Upton and that the words redifor and beetzsel mean REDIFOR is READY FOR anything; BEETZSEL is the reel that BEATS ALL. Also that the reel was made sometime around 1916. John you were pretty much right on with the value. Thanks again for all the help. Mike
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john elder
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Address : John SAVU, 2501 Andrews Dr. Warren OHIO 44481 Ph# 1-330-372-4218 email intrest? you guesed it Redifor reels Pfluger spinners and spoons! I know for a fact this Person has more in his head about redifors than most folks and a lot he hasent told yet! Your other ohio conection Col. Milton Lorens aka SWIM JIG -
dmouse
Re: Read about this somewhere
Could someone email me the address or phone of the NFLCC G*bass*ette? The did an artical about my father a few years back and i am interested in getting a copy. He died 3 years ago and someone told me about the artical. email me at my Dad's name was Doyle Cothron of Ezway Lure company. thanks.Brian F. wrote:I seem to remember an article done on the reel but can't remember where. A quick look thru the ORCA back issue index and Phil's index of the NFLCC G*bass*ette by John didn't find anything. Anybody else remember something on this subject?
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dmouse
Help find info on the NFLCC Gazzette
dmouse wrote:Could someone email me the address or phone of the NFLCC G*bass*ette? The did an artical about my father a few years back and i am interested in getting a copy. He died 3 years ago and someone told me about the artical. email me at my Dad's name was Doyle Cothron of Ezway Lure company. thanks.Brian F. wrote:I seem to remember an article done on the reel but can't remember where. A quick look thru the ORCA back issue index and Phil's index of the NFLCC G*bass*ette by John didn't find anything. Anybody else remember something on this subject?
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Stefan Duma
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- Location: England
- Contact:
Redifor Beetzsell Reel
I wrote an article on this reel in issue 39 of the A.T.O. and the text is as follows
I had been aware of this company and it’s products for many years having read an article about them in the 1980’s. When I finally managed to get hold of one of their reels I thought it was time to let you know about them.
The Redifor Rod & Reel was formed by George W Upton in about 1904 in Warren Ohio.
He was later joined by Benjamin F. Flegel as General Manager in about 1908. These two inventive Americans took out many patents for fishing tackle.
I have found 12 US patents for tackle that the pair of them invented, either individually or together. The majority of the patents are for reels but three cover rod handles and one is for an automatic hook.
The first reel made by the company is the Redifor Multiplying Fly reel sold by Abercrombie & Fitch. When I first saw this reel it reminded me very much of the Hardy Silex multiplying reels.
However in this reel the handles sit on a flat disc that rotates around the central spindle therefore keeping the handle within the confines of the endplate.
It had a 3:1 multiplication and a capacity of 80 yards. With it’s option of free spool available by simply throwing a thumb nut, it could also be used for bait casting.
It was made of aluminium with nickel silver side plates. The gears and pinion were English steel and phosphor bronze used for the bearings.
By 1910 two versions of this reel were available, the model X and the model B. The first model had no free spool and had been upgraded to a 4:1 ratio. It sold for $9.00
The model B had the same ratio but had the throw off free spool which made it a slightly heavier reel and it sold for $15.00.
According to the catalogue descriptions of the reel it was made from a variety of metals including “Redifor metal”, (this was described as being lighter than aluminium and very strong) and Combination metal (which was as light as aluminium and very strong).
This could have been one of the many new alloys that were appearing around this time and the Redifor could have been magnesium.
In 1908 Benjamin Flegel was granted patent 881,850 which covered the workings for a new reel. This was the Redifor Self Thumbing reel also known as the Anti Back-Lash reel. This reel had an anti backlash device as per the patent. It sold for $6.00 and was two inches in diameter with a capacity of 80 yards and like all the other reels a 4:1 ratio.
An improved version of the reel was offered later with the addition of Jewell end caps for $1.50 extra.
With his background as a Jeweller and his interest in tournament casting it was inevitable that he would produce this type of tackle.
Sometime around 1910 there was a problem with the company and production of the reels ceased for a time.
One theory is that the factory burnt down caused by the machining of magnesium metal. The company continued to exist but was sold to Pflueger.
Benjamin Flegal with no job, had left the company in 1911 and started his own business whilst still working on the fishing reels.
By 1913 the Self Thumbing reel had been granted the Model F designation and was available in two different materials: Nickel plate or gun metal and again the option of Jewelled end caps was offered.
The Anti-Back-Lash reel was sold to Pflueger and described in their catalogue as the Pflueger–Redifor-Anti-Back-Lash reel. They sold it from 1915 until 1928 when it disappeared from the catalogues.
An improvement to this reel was made in 1915 when patent 1,140,779 was issued. This was an improvement on the patent of Gilmore granted in 1907 and the Flegals of 1908 and was granted solely to George Upton.
The next reel that the company introduced was described in the 1910 Abercombie & Fitch catalogue as the Model D Free-Spool Bait Casting Reel and sold for $20.
This reel used the same principle that we were to see employed by the Rivers Company of Sweden on the Expert reel. You simply cast the bait out and free spool would automatically be engaged.
This was a high quality reel at $20 one of the most expensive reels on the market.
In the same year they offered a tournament reel and again it was included in the 1910 Abercrombie & Fitch catalogue.
The reel was a joint venture between tournament caster Lou S. Darling and Benjamin Flegel. What made this reel different from other tournament reels on the market was It consisted of two spools.
The line is on the right hand spool and the caster uses his thumb on the left hand spool thereby never having to put his thumb on the line and potentially slow down the cast.
A thumb rest was also included in the construction of the reel ensuring that the thumb was always in the same place on every cast. It also had the throw off facility of the Model D Free-Spool reel.
This, at $25 was the most expensive reel the company made. Another version at $20 was available but it had no thumb rest and only one spool. It was designated the Flegel Tournament reel.
In 1915 Flegel was granted patent 1,151,349 for a very ingenious device. It was the Redifor Spooler, designed to fit on the front of any makers reel it only worked when the line was being retrieved. When the cast was being made it threw the spooler out of gear. It sold for $3.00 and was available in three sizes.
Although the patent was granted in 1915 it was actually being sold in 1910 and the application being submitted the year before.
In 1915 the Beetzsel reel was introduced. The name came from the saying that the reel “Beats all” and it is the most famous reel that the company made. This is due to the fact that there are more of them available to the collector than the other reels the company made.
This reel incorporated all the good ideas that the two men had introduced in their reel making endeavours. It had the automatic free spool to disengage the gears, the level wind only operated when the line was being retrieved when casting out it did not engage, thus ensuring friction free casting.
Three patents for level winds and their improvements were used on this reel. 1,212,288 in 1917 by Upton, 1,282,990 in 1918 by Upton and Flegel, and finally in November 1918 1,284,193 by Upton.
The reel or the design was eventually sold to Shakespeare who continued to make the reel until 1934.
Benjamin Flegel had left Ohio and moved to Racine in Wisconsin where he manufactured automatic lighting products.
George Upton died in Warren sometime in the early 1920’s as there is a reference in the 1925 Shakespeare catalogue to the late George Upton.
These reels are superbly made and are very much sought after. I was really lucky to acquire my example.
I have not been able to produce more pictures of the other reels made by the company as I have been unable to find any.
I do have a copy of the 1910 Abercrombie & Fitch catalogue but the quality is not that good.
Stefan Duma
I had been aware of this company and it’s products for many years having read an article about them in the 1980’s. When I finally managed to get hold of one of their reels I thought it was time to let you know about them.
The Redifor Rod & Reel was formed by George W Upton in about 1904 in Warren Ohio.
He was later joined by Benjamin F. Flegel as General Manager in about 1908. These two inventive Americans took out many patents for fishing tackle.
I have found 12 US patents for tackle that the pair of them invented, either individually or together. The majority of the patents are for reels but three cover rod handles and one is for an automatic hook.
The first reel made by the company is the Redifor Multiplying Fly reel sold by Abercrombie & Fitch. When I first saw this reel it reminded me very much of the Hardy Silex multiplying reels.
However in this reel the handles sit on a flat disc that rotates around the central spindle therefore keeping the handle within the confines of the endplate.
It had a 3:1 multiplication and a capacity of 80 yards. With it’s option of free spool available by simply throwing a thumb nut, it could also be used for bait casting.
It was made of aluminium with nickel silver side plates. The gears and pinion were English steel and phosphor bronze used for the bearings.
By 1910 two versions of this reel were available, the model X and the model B. The first model had no free spool and had been upgraded to a 4:1 ratio. It sold for $9.00
The model B had the same ratio but had the throw off free spool which made it a slightly heavier reel and it sold for $15.00.
According to the catalogue descriptions of the reel it was made from a variety of metals including “Redifor metal”, (this was described as being lighter than aluminium and very strong) and Combination metal (which was as light as aluminium and very strong).
This could have been one of the many new alloys that were appearing around this time and the Redifor could have been magnesium.
In 1908 Benjamin Flegel was granted patent 881,850 which covered the workings for a new reel. This was the Redifor Self Thumbing reel also known as the Anti Back-Lash reel. This reel had an anti backlash device as per the patent. It sold for $6.00 and was two inches in diameter with a capacity of 80 yards and like all the other reels a 4:1 ratio.
An improved version of the reel was offered later with the addition of Jewell end caps for $1.50 extra.
With his background as a Jeweller and his interest in tournament casting it was inevitable that he would produce this type of tackle.
Sometime around 1910 there was a problem with the company and production of the reels ceased for a time.
One theory is that the factory burnt down caused by the machining of magnesium metal. The company continued to exist but was sold to Pflueger.
Benjamin Flegal with no job, had left the company in 1911 and started his own business whilst still working on the fishing reels.
By 1913 the Self Thumbing reel had been granted the Model F designation and was available in two different materials: Nickel plate or gun metal and again the option of Jewelled end caps was offered.
The Anti-Back-Lash reel was sold to Pflueger and described in their catalogue as the Pflueger–Redifor-Anti-Back-Lash reel. They sold it from 1915 until 1928 when it disappeared from the catalogues.
An improvement to this reel was made in 1915 when patent 1,140,779 was issued. This was an improvement on the patent of Gilmore granted in 1907 and the Flegals of 1908 and was granted solely to George Upton.
The next reel that the company introduced was described in the 1910 Abercombie & Fitch catalogue as the Model D Free-Spool Bait Casting Reel and sold for $20.
This reel used the same principle that we were to see employed by the Rivers Company of Sweden on the Expert reel. You simply cast the bait out and free spool would automatically be engaged.
This was a high quality reel at $20 one of the most expensive reels on the market.
In the same year they offered a tournament reel and again it was included in the 1910 Abercrombie & Fitch catalogue.
The reel was a joint venture between tournament caster Lou S. Darling and Benjamin Flegel. What made this reel different from other tournament reels on the market was It consisted of two spools.
The line is on the right hand spool and the caster uses his thumb on the left hand spool thereby never having to put his thumb on the line and potentially slow down the cast.
A thumb rest was also included in the construction of the reel ensuring that the thumb was always in the same place on every cast. It also had the throw off facility of the Model D Free-Spool reel.
This, at $25 was the most expensive reel the company made. Another version at $20 was available but it had no thumb rest and only one spool. It was designated the Flegel Tournament reel.
In 1915 Flegel was granted patent 1,151,349 for a very ingenious device. It was the Redifor Spooler, designed to fit on the front of any makers reel it only worked when the line was being retrieved. When the cast was being made it threw the spooler out of gear. It sold for $3.00 and was available in three sizes.
Although the patent was granted in 1915 it was actually being sold in 1910 and the application being submitted the year before.
In 1915 the Beetzsel reel was introduced. The name came from the saying that the reel “Beats all” and it is the most famous reel that the company made. This is due to the fact that there are more of them available to the collector than the other reels the company made.
This reel incorporated all the good ideas that the two men had introduced in their reel making endeavours. It had the automatic free spool to disengage the gears, the level wind only operated when the line was being retrieved when casting out it did not engage, thus ensuring friction free casting.
Three patents for level winds and their improvements were used on this reel. 1,212,288 in 1917 by Upton, 1,282,990 in 1918 by Upton and Flegel, and finally in November 1918 1,284,193 by Upton.
The reel or the design was eventually sold to Shakespeare who continued to make the reel until 1934.
Benjamin Flegel had left Ohio and moved to Racine in Wisconsin where he manufactured automatic lighting products.
George Upton died in Warren sometime in the early 1920’s as there is a reference in the 1925 Shakespeare catalogue to the late George Upton.
These reels are superbly made and are very much sought after. I was really lucky to acquire my example.
I have not been able to produce more pictures of the other reels made by the company as I have been unable to find any.
I do have a copy of the 1910 Abercrombie & Fitch catalogue but the quality is not that good.
Stefan Duma