Kopf reel

Ed Clark · Post by **Ed Clark** » Tue Feb 22, 2005 6:27 am

Looking to trade an aluminum Kopf reel for an aluminum Hendryx reel. The Kopf is missing one screw in front and the back oil cap. If interested send an email. More pictures available upon request. I believe this Kopf is a fairly rare reel with name stamped to inside of front plate. It has nice coined edge on both plates.

Thanks,
Ed

tjolds · Post by **tjolds** » Fri Feb 25, 2005 6:39 pm

Ed, I wish I had a Hendrix reel to trade you. I just purchased a Trowbridge Reel, probably made by Kopf, and I like the reels. Mine is nickel plated brass.

Jim Madden · Post by **Jim Madden** » Fri Feb 25, 2005 10:09 pm

Ed, I came across this at Montpellier. It's a Kooney Kasting. I haven't straightened the crank or cleaned it yet, but I liked the tapered bakelite centers and the cylindrical screw heads. It has the Pflueger-looking foot with the molded pillar wrap. The stamping on the foot is "R3." I'm sure it's Montague, but can you tell me anything about the name or foot marking? Jim

Ed Clark · Post by **Ed Clark** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 7:15 am

First - to tjolds - Kopf made a pretty fair variety of reels. I have seen some marked as Trowbridge-Boston. While in Allentown, PA this year the subject of our reel breakfast was Kopf and his reels. There was a nice presentation by Steve Vernon and Henry Caldwell who have nice Kopf collections and are more knowledgeable than me on Kopf's reels. Also Jim Garrett and Skip Brooks have nice Kopf reels. If you would like more information maybe some of these people would share their knowledge and maybe some photos. I'm sure there are other Kopf collectors whom I don't know. If you Kopf collectors are out there maybe you can help this guy out.

Second - Jim Madden - That it is nice looking reel! I surely am not the expert to ask that question. I have never heard of a Kooney Kasting reel before. The foot does not tell me much - I have seen them on a wide variety of reels. The R3 may just be a bench mark to match pieces of the reel. If you added more pictures and posted a new subject you may getter a better response from more knowledgeable people.

Sorry I was not more help to either one of you.

Ed

Jim Madden · Post by **Jim Madden** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 10:28 am

Ed, every bit of conjecture helps. It usually takes ideas from several members to put together a profile for a little known reel. You'll run into a lot of that with Montague. If you haven't teamed up with Don Champion yet, you should. He's working on the subtle differences between Montague and Pflueger. Also, check out the back issues of Reel News in which Phil White covers Montague "generic" reels. Thanks, Ed. Jim

Dale Noll · Post by **Dale Noll** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 12:34 pm

Jim,

I have a reel like in your photo. Same handle and appearance except screws are not cylindrical. Reel diameter is 2". Have had for several yr, but seemed too delicate to disassemble. Unfortunetly, the drag clicker is missing.

I also have two others. One marked 80 on foot is 2-1/8 dia. Only two of the screws are cylindrical. Weighted handle is fancy style Montague. The 3rd is 2-1/4 dia also marked 80 on foot, missing oil caps, with slightl longer handle typical of Montague. Oil caps fit all 3 each reels.

Don't know how to post photos. Glad to know a name. Where can one find info on Kooney Kasting? Am I right to mark these Kooney Kasting mfg?

Thanks, Dale

Jim Madden · Post by **Jim Madden** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 1:02 pm

Dale, Phil may correct me if I'm wrong, but in my experience with some trade reels, it appears that a standard reel was offered by the manufacturer. It would save money and time if the trade company ordered it unstamped. If they wanted tooling set up for stamping or other slight modifications, it would be at greater cost, and there was probably a certain lower limit number of reels that had to be bought to make it worth their while. You'll see the same unmarked reels in different companies' catalogs, and when you find these reels, you'll never be able to tell which company they came from unless you're lucky enough to find some paperwork. I always like to find the stamped ones because it's enjoyable tracking down origins of names like Kooney Kaster. The KK is small reel with only 2" plates and 1 and 1/2" spool.

Len Sawisch · Post by **Len Sawisch** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 8:03 pm

Here is my Quadruple

that I got off ebay two years back from an ORCA member who listed it as German Silver and in VG+ shape! Anyway, it is the same reel as yours, Jim, down to the R 3 on the foot, but with the wrong handle (mine being the wrong one).

I side with Jim in that these are Monti reels (although fairly early ones) and you could get them with whatever name you wanted (if the price was right). Milt sent me five similar reels to look at in larger sizes and at least three were clearly related with the same side plates and screw types.

Len

Post by **john elder** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 9:23 pm

Here's my version of that reel. It appears to be identical to Jim's, only mine says "R4" rather than "R3" on the foot. It's 2 1/4 in diameter, with a 1 1 /2 in spool width.

Dale Noll · Post by **Dale Noll** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 10:50 pm

Suggest we need one more number to get a true seqence which correlates R3 and R4 with size of diameter. I remeasured my three using a calipher.

The 2" Dia has 1.58" between sideplaes. The 2-1/8 Dia measures 1.68" between sideplates, and the 2-1/4 measures 1.65" between sideplates. These latter two are quite a bit different than expected.

If someone can posts a R 3-1/2 which measures 2-1/8 dia, it would fix the sequence, or an R5 with a larger dia. Maybe Milts reels have larger dia and number.

Just in case.

Dale.

Jim Madden · Post by **Jim Madden** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 11:47 pm

This is an example of why there's no board like Reel Talk. A question is posed and three members post reels that fit the category and tell what they know to help. Will you see that anywhere else? Thanks Ed, Dale and Len. Someone figure out what the R means. When I made my measurement of the spool, I could see it went into the inner plate a little, so I added a bit to get the 1 and 1/2" span. The true distance between plates is 1 and 7/16" (using a crude tape measure.) I wonder how many sizes of "R" reels there are out there. Jim

Jim Madden · Post by **Jim Madden** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 11:49 pm

Forgot to mention John who has the best looking reel of the bunch!

Dale Noll · Post by **Dale Noll** » Sun Feb 27, 2005 2:33 pm

These all look good. By the way, a Vom Hofe just sold on ebay 7136634033 for $77. This small 2-1/4 dia reel was marked with a 3-1/2 on foot. Guess there is hope for a R 3-1/2 Kooney. Handle sure looks like these reels. Must be a connection?

reels4me · Post by **reels4me** » Tue Mar 01, 2005 6:06 pm

ED I have two, one I bought from the late Bill Crowley in Louisville about
4 years ago and the other I picked up in Allentown 2 years ago 1st in very good shape. 2nd is a 'beater', 1 end cap missing, 2 wrong screws on
foot fastening, offer it as a plus if you get a buyer I paid $50. $20 plus
shipping if your buyer is interested. . . .Jack

Ed Clark · Post by **Ed Clark** » Wed Mar 02, 2005 6:00 am

Jack,

I am interested. Could you send me an email with a couple of pictures?

Thanks,
Ed

Teal · Post by **Teal** » Wed Mar 02, 2005 11:25 am

Jim,

Can you fill me in on Kooney Kaster? I have never heard of it before; is the reel stamped KK? Is it possible to upload a picture of the stamping on the side?

Thanks,

Dr. Todd E.A. Larson

Jim Madden · Post by **Jim Madden** » Thu Mar 03, 2005 9:51 pm

Todd, here's a pic of the lettering. Let me know if you want to see the tailplate and foot. I'll send a couple images to you. It'd be nice to know who sold it back then. Jim

Jim Madden · Post by **Jim Madden** » Thu Mar 03, 2005 9:56 pm

That's definitely a K at the beginning. It just doesn't show in the picture.

Teal · Post by **Teal** » Wed Mar 16, 2005 1:29 pm

Hi Jim,

I've been mulling over the Kooney Kasting conundrum for some time...I'm finishing an article for the next edition of the NFLCC magazine about hardware companies and the tackle trade. One of the companies I am writing about is E.C. Simmons Hardware Co. of St. Louis, one of the largest wholesale hardware jobbers in America from the 1870s-1930s. Their most famous trade name was Keen Kutter, established in 1870. As a result of Keen Kutter's success, they began branding everything under the sun with two K's--Kar King, King Kord, Keen Klipper, and Klipper Klub are just a few of dozens and dozens of trade names they used for everything under the sun.

Anyway, they branded a lot of reels with Keen Kaster. I think what you have is an old Simmons trade reel using a heretofore unknown KK trade name. Now, of course, this doesn't help establish in any way who MADE the reel, but at least you have an idea of who might have SOLD the reel.

I will dig through some older Simmons catalogs and if I find anything, I will certainly let you know.

Cheers,

Todd

Jim Madden · Post by **Jim Madden** » Wed Mar 16, 2005 10:40 pm

Todd, I'll be looking forward to that article. Your work on those hardware companies is a great idea and will help us catagorize a bunch of reels that at the moment seem to have no connection anywhere. I can understand the meaning of Keen but Koony baffles me. Maybe the alliteration meant more than meaning. Keep up the good work. Jim

Reel Geezer · Post by **Reel Geezer** » Thu Mar 17, 2005 8:18 am

Todd: The only problem with your proposed article is that only 30% of the readers of this board (or at least ORCA members) will read it. That was the percentage of ORCA members who belonged to the NFLCC when I last compared the rosters.

Kopf reel

Kopf reel

Kopf Reel

Koony Kasting

Kaster

Kaster

How about this one?

Montague

Montague

Ed Clarks Kopf

Kooney Kaster

KK

again

Kooney Kasting

Kaster