Club consolidation? Opinions?

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Steve
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Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Steve »

In the March, 2019, issue of The N.F.L.C.C. Gazette, Stuart Strange, NFLCC President, suggests "rolling up" six tackle collector clubs "underneath the NFLCC." He provides counts of the various clubs based on followers of their various Facebook pages. These include 7040 followers of lure collector club sites, 1899 followers of tackle collector club sites, 785 followers of a decoy collector club site, and 1176 followers of a reel collector club (ORCA) site. [No rod collector groups need apply, I guess.]

Without getting into the faults inherent in "counting" anything this way, how would you--as a dues-paying member of ORCA--feel about "rolling up...underneath the NFLCC?"

Please indicate all clubs in which you are a dues-paying member.

Steve Vernon
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Midway Tommy D
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Midway Tommy D »

Steve wrote: Without getting into the faults inherent in "counting" anything this way, how would you--as a dues-paying member of ORCA--feel about "rolling up...underneath the NFLCC?"
Just so we're clear, what exactly does "rolling up...underneath the NFLCC?" mean? :? & BTW, I'm ORCA only with no want, need or intention to be included elsewhere.
Love those Open Face Spinning Reels! (Especially ABU & ABU/Zebco)

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john elder
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by john elder »

Let me think, NO
ORCA member since 1999
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Specializing in saltwater reels...and fly reels...and oh, yeah, kentucky style reels.....and those tiny little RP reels.....oh, heck...i collect fishing reels!...and fly rods....and lures

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Robin Sayler
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Robin Sayler »

Nope, ORCA only. I dislike the way many of the other clubs are run and would not consider continuing membership in a consolidated group like that. I can continue to sit at home and enjoy my reels without any club affiliation if that became reality.
I would like any unusual pflueger casting reels!

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Steve
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Steve »

Just in case anyone wondered:
As a life member of both NFLCC and ORCA, I think consolidation would be disastrous for ORCAn interests.

Steve Vernon
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NEW BOOK: ANTIQUE FISHING REELS, 2nd Edition
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"Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose."

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Mike N
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Mike N »

Meh.

meh
1.
expressing a lack of interest or enthusiasm.
"Meh. I'm not impressed so far"
adjective
1.
uninspiring; unexceptional.
"a lot of his movies are … meh"

I am also a member of the NFLCC and FATC.

We formed our club, in part, because we reel collectors were ignored in NFLCC publications, kind of like how that second cousin who’s done some jail time gets treated at a family reunion. I doubt we would be treated any better now.

Mike N
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Reeltyme

Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Reeltyme »

Hi All, Although I am no longer a dues paying member of ORCA and have become one of the “outside voyeurs” on the chat room, I do have an opinion on the proposed consolidation of the clubs,,, terrible idea! The thought of scrolling through pages of information on items I have no interest in just to gleam some bit of info of a vintage Kov or V.H. or a reel I have never seen,, scary!! All the while the “others” are upset with someone posting a thread about an undiscovered bait caster. Think long and hard grasshopper?
Randy McConnell
Reeltyme

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Mike N
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Mike N »

Since our website and forum are far better than any other club’s, and our publications are at least as good, perhaps we should invite those other clubs to “roll up” under our ORCA banner, instead.

Kinda like this scene from Top Gun:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2fWr6CBARMw


Mike N
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john elder
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by john elder »

So sorry to hear that you are no longer a member of ORCA, Randy! Dropping enrollment in both Clubs is why such discussions have raised their ugly heads...and As you indicate, they are ugly. We need your financial support and in return, you get all the info about the reels that you desire most...and for about the price of a new Vom Hofe crank nut :Bawl:
ORCA member since 1999
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Specializing in saltwater reels...and fly reels...and oh, yeah, kentucky style reels.....and those tiny little RP reels.....oh, heck...i collect fishing reels!...and fly rods....and lures

arley
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by arley »

My inclination is no.
you can tune a piano,but you can't tuna fish.

colby sorrells
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by colby sorrells »

2 different groups of folks, 2 different ways of doing business. They split for a reason and that reason (or reasons) has not gone away. Tackle collecting is different today than it was when these groups were formed. I would vote against any combination and yes I am a dues paying member of both. Colby

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Post by Don Champion »

They were combined when I joined. I like it far better apart. As far as I was concerned the lure collectors were more about selling than collecting.

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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Brian F. »

colby sorrells wrote:2 different groups of folks, 2 different ways of doing business. They split for a reason and that reason (or reasons) has not gone away. Tackle collecting is different today than it was when these groups were formed. I would vote against any combination and yes I am a dues paying member of both. Colby
I agree completely. I joined both after the split because they not only both have value to me but I enjoy their differences, even if a lot of us are in both. Seems there are other ways we can support each other, like ORCA does with the FATC.
Aloha
Brian F.
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Mike N
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Mike N »

Steve wrote:

“...These include 7040 followers of lure collector club sites, 1899 followers of tackle collector club sites, 785 followers of a decoy collector club site, and 1176 followers of a reel collector club (ORCA) site. [No rod collector groups need apply, I guess.]

So, who and where are these 1899 collectors, and of what? FATC? CATC? Maybe Paul and our Facebook gurus can enlighten us?

Mike N
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Midway Tommy D
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Midway Tommy D »

Mike N wrote:Steve wrote:

“...These include 7040 followers of lure collector club sites, 1899 followers of tackle collector club sites, 785 followers of a decoy collector club site, and 1176 followers of a reel collector club (ORCA) site. [No rod collector groups need apply, I guess.]

So, who and where are these 1899 collectors, and of what? FATC? CATC? Maybe Paul and our Facebook gurus can enlighten us?

Mike N
I view those numbers with the same confidence that I have in governmental, economic, etc. polls and statistics. How were they tweaked and how many are the same individuals following multiple FB sites? Followers are not the same as registered participants or users.
Love those Open Face Spinning Reels! (Especially ABU & ABU/Zebco)

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Paul M
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Paul M »

FACTS:

ORCA has a Facebook PAGE. NFLCC has both a Facebook Page and a Facebook GROUP. Anyone can see posts on a Facebook PAGE and “like” it or “follow” it without any obligation. Users do not register to see a page. Only Page administrators can create a post in the main timeline. A Facebook Page is more like an advertising billboard rather than an interactive bulletin board. Posts by general users on Facebook Pages are recorded as “Visitor Posts” and don’t show up in the main timeline of the page. Non-Admins have to go looking for Visitor Posts. If you “follow” the page, new posts on the PAGE will generate a notification on your Facebook account, letting you know there is something new to see.

ORCA never formed a Facebook Group because we already have our own social media platform - Reel Talk, with 95,452 posts covering 19,099 Topics recorded (since the counters were reset Jan 15 2012?). Everything on Reel Talk that wasn’t erased or “lost” (e.g. Photobucket fiasco) has been retained so we have a monstrous Reel Talk database plus the Reel Research and Library functions on our website. Facebook Groups do not have the same sort of controls to sort topics and filter through posts etc, so our special purpose board is more effective for the way we have used it.

Registrants to a Facebook Group, like the "NFLCC Message Board Group" with its 810 Members can post into the main timeline of the Group and set their account to receive notifications of new posts. In both cases, users can opt to shut off notifications but still follow or be a Group member. Facebook Group members can usually see each other’s names and depending on the Group there are different features and policies. Facebook Page users are only known to the Admins.

The actual number of ORCA Facebook Page Followers is currently 1,246 (up from Stuart’s 1,176) which is a cumulative number since inception of the ORCA Facebook page (around Aug 2011 ). During the past 30 days there were 206 “views” of the ORCA Facebook page. In the same period, our posts were pushed out to 3,434 Facebook accounts but only a fraction of those, 206, actually looked. Over the past year, about 2,000 visits to the ORCA website were generated by the ORCA Facebook page. Over the past year, the ORCA website was been visited by more than 1,700 users. Reel Talk has about 2,600 registered users but only a fraction of those are active at any time and many of those accounts have been dormant for some time. You can’t plan using these numbers except perhaps in terms of proportions.

Having said all that, the NFLCC Gazette has a published circulation number of 2,400. I guess that equates to PAYING members. Circulation of the Reel News is about a quarter of that. The numbers and proportions of PAYING members are the only ones that count IMHO. These are the numbers that generate revenue from membership dues and are the pool of potential volunteers.
Paul Manuel

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Steve
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Steve »

...how many are the same individuals following multiple FB sites? Followers are not the same as registered participants or users.
FACTS:
Exactly. Why those "counts" are meaningless. :idea:
Without getting into the faults inherent in "counting" anything this way,...
I shoulda known that wouldn't work. :bash:

Steve Vernon
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NEW BOOK: ANTIQUE FISHING REELS, 2nd Edition
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"Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose."

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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Stef Duma »

I concur with everyone here, we would just be swallowed up and diluted.

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reelsmith.
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by reelsmith. »

Stef Duma wrote:I concur with everyone here, we would just be swallowed up and diluted.
Agreed. I was struggling with a succinct way of saying it ...Stef found the words for me.

Dean.
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by RAM »

No

Bad Bob

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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Ron Mc »

Stef has always demonstrated good insight, as well as a good way with words.

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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Don Champion »

I remember the first ORCA convention I went to. It was in St. Charles, IL. I was an ORCA member but not NFLCC. They had to call a meeting to decide to let me in. They finally did. What a mess!

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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Roger Schulz »

When Stu proposed this idea, I am not sure he thought the process through very well. The administrative side to do this would not be easy and NFLCC would be a big looser in power and funding.

For example:
1. You would have to change the name to Fishing Tackle Collectors Club.
2. We are non-profit with a mission for education of our members in fishing reels. NFLCC is not non-profit and I am not sure if they have such a mission.
3. The Board of the NFLCC would have to be reduced to one and each of the organization would have one board member. President would be elected from everyone. NFLCC could no longer have Regional Directors.
4. Funds of the organizations would have to be combined. NFLCC would have to give up close to $300K. Every organization would be equal.
5. Not much savings on personel. You would have one full-time editor and one full-time accountant to do the work that needs to be done for such a large organization. That would cost close to $200K/year. Much of that is now donated to some extent (my salary and Richards is not the market standard for those positions) by the different clubs.
6. Funds made by Regional shows would go into a central account to be used by all organizations.
7. You would have only one magazine for all organizations.
8. You would have one dues for all organizations which means the NFLCC dues would increase since they would no longer be subsidized by Regional show profits.

What Stu proposed would be a lot more than just changing the magazine that comes out. You would have to change the entire process of how each organization operates. That includes starting over with new Bylaws.

My view.

Roger Schulz

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reelsmith.
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by reelsmith. »

Thanks for detailing all of that Roger.

My "no" is now a "NO"

Dean.
Wanted: Kosmic Items, Small Leather Fly Reel Cases, Early Fishing Related Bottles, Fly Reels and Pre-1900 Angling/Casting Medals.

http://www.tackletreasures.com/

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Mike N
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Re: Club consolidation? Opinions?

Post by Mike N »

Roger:

I agree with you, but not too sure about paragraph 2.

From the NFLCC website: “The National Fishing Lure Collectors Club (NFLCC) is a non-profit, educational, international organization founded in 1976.”


From the LOUISIANA SECRETARY OF STATE PUBLIC WEBSITE:

Name Type
THE NATIONAL FISHING LURE COLLECTORS CLUB Non-Profit Corporation

Active

Previous Names
Business: THE NATIONAL FISHING LURE COLLECTORS CLUB
Charter Number: 05211170N
Registration Date: 8/10/1982



Mike N.
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