The Real Marhoff Reel

Len Sawisch · Post by **Len Sawisch** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 8:29 pm

The Marhoff Marhoff – early observations

Marhoff was an employee and contemporary of William Shakespeare. His level wind design helped move Shakespeare (and eventually other fresh water reel manufacturers) out of the non-level wind reel market. Shakespeare allowed Marhoff to make his “own” reel at the Shakespeare factory. At least 998 and less than 1,632 reels were stamped Marhoff Reel Company, Kalamazoo, Mich.

How does one distinguish a Marhoff Marhoff Reel from a Shakespeare Marhoff? First blush, it is hard. Here are SN 206, 998, and 1632. The last one is a Shajespeare.

All the early Marhoffs have black hard rubber head plate covers with an off center metal circle insert and drive gear collar. They all are level wind reels with lightly tapered foot and back pillars, and counter-balance handles. They all look like Shakespeare reels.

Here’s a few keys to Marhoff model Marhoffs:
1. Back plate is stamped Marhoff Reel Company, Kalamazoo, Mich. This is generally the best indicator, but then who reads the stamping on the first blush? http://orcaonline.org/images/pixel.gif? ... 20back.jpg
2. Back plate worm gear bearing cup is 3/16” (1/8” on later models)
3. Only two screws (tips visible from outside) hold on the front metal circle insert http://orcaonline.org/images/pixel.gif? ... 20face.jpg (three on later models)
4. Click roller has checkered knurling (coined on later models) http://orcaonline.org/images/pixel.gif? ... 0click.jpg
5. Metal head plate is solid with a bridged spool bearing cup that protrudes through the metal circle insert in the hard rubber face cover, so bearing cap actually helps hold on the face plate assembly http://orcaonline.org/images/pixel.gif? ... inside.jpg (the spool journal bearing is pressed in as part of the metal insert on later models)

Thanks to Dale Noll for loaning me his Marhoff Marhoff to compare to mine! Next I will venture down to Jackson Mich to look at Bill Sonnet’s!

Len

Steve · Post by **Steve** » Tue Oct 04, 2005 3:37 am

Len,
Here's #978. The line guide does not have a double curve. I'll take some new pics and send them with some measurements.

Second reel down at:
http://www.antiquefishingreels.info/LW.htm

reels4me,member · Post by **reels4me,member** » Tue Oct 04, 2005 10:50 am

Hi Len--You almost have satisfied my curiousity on subject, next time
will you let me touch or handle it. Jack
Steve those samples are neat ! I`ll take three Girouds and two
Boardmans of couse I`ll pay shipping Jack

Dale Noll · Post by **Dale Noll** » Tue Oct 04, 2005 4:55 pm

Len: Good job. Got reel back today ok. Thanks for cleaning and Lub oil. What kind of handle do I need to find? Do any of the other Shakes fit?
Dale.

Alan Baracco · Post by **Alan Baracco** » Tue Oct 04, 2005 5:27 pm

Len,

Great description. Re. the click knob knurling, instead of "coined" numismatists would call that "reeded". Cheers,

Alan

reels4me,member · Post by **reels4me,member** » Tue Oct 04, 2005 5:51 pm

Alan another friend sent me a 7" Cohiba, know you`d appreciate that !

Len Sawisch · Post by **Len Sawisch** » Tue Oct 04, 2005 8:27 pm

Thanks All!

Dale, You are welcome

- check Steve's pic above to see what the reel handle looks like in nice shape - here is another shot of the one off my 900 http://orcaonline.org/images/pixel.gif? ... handle.jpg

Steve, that is the nicest Marhoff Marhoff I have every seen - is the click roller reeded or milled in a checkered pattern? And is the spfeetle extending a full 3/16" from the back plate on yours as well?

Allan, thanks for the heads up. So "reeded" means vertical slots or grooves relative to the flat sides. What if the slots are at a diagonal? And if any coins have a checkered edge, what is the correct term?

And Jack, No, you may not handle my Marhoff after you have been fondling a 7" Cohiba. I am surprised you even asked!

Anyone else out there got a Marhoff Marhoff? Want to know it's serial number and if your line guide is like the one Steve has, or a more traditional double-bowed?

Thanks!

Steve · Post by **Steve** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 5:16 am

To phrase a coin:
Old Wm. Mills & Son catalogs described reels with ridges cut into the plate edges as having "milled edges," whether the ridges were at a diagonal or not. Using the same method to describe little ridges on the edges of other reels, we would say the click wheel (or roller) has "marhofed edges" in this case.

Later reels would have shakespeared edges.

For those of you who don't have a reel talk-English dictionary, "spfeetle" is a word coined very recently to refer to "back plate worm gear bearing cup." cool-thumb And yes, it extends 3/16" from the Marhoff Marhoff tailplate.

Used to have another, beat-up Marhoff Marhoff which had a line guide with a double curve. When I ran across the one with the one-curve guide, I said, "Oh, gee--Not!" and grabbed it.

Jack, I'm also surprised you asked.

Tom E. · Post by **Tom E.** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 8:24 pm

Len or whoever, so tell me about the narrow spool Marhoff. Was it after the war only? Or were there some earlier ones. Also, did it have an aluminum spool? Also2, does anyone have a plastic or cork arbor that would fit my narrow spool Marhoff? I am itchin to go cast and catch with it. Haven't seen many were many made?

T.

Warren Platt · Post by **Warren Platt** » Thu Oct 06, 2005 7:32 am

Tom,
As far as I know, and that ain't far, none of the narrow spool Marhoff reels came from Shakespeare. They are an after market combination of two reels, the 1973 Sportcast and the Marhoff. Am I right or wrong here experts?
Warren

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Oct 06, 2005 9:27 am

Warren,That is possible. On this one the handle is clearly a "Sportcast" handle. What's interesting is the spool is aluminum and it is a real "spinner".

Maybe we can get Jim Nedela to jump in - I got it from him. Jim, what do you know about the roots of the reel? (Len, did you program this thing to substitute the Milt jumping sun for the word "j u m p"?)

I still need a plastic or cork arbor. Presume the Sportcast one's would fit.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Oct 06, 2005 12:25 pm

I was introduced to the existance of "narrow" Marhoffs by Bill Peters back in the 19's and searched for years before I found one. Bill told me in the old days for a price you could get any reel customized at the factory to just about whatever you wanted (narrowed, gold or silver plated, real jewels, fancy engraving, agate bushings). He also taught me that when it comes to "tournament" reels, every aspect of the reel was a potential target for tinkering, so it can be hard to tell what was "original."

As Warran notes, you can make a narrow aluminum Marhoff using a narrow aluminum Sportcast frame and Marhoff side plates. The foot pillars would not have the typical Marhoff taper. Or you can use a narrow Professional or Standard Professional frame if you want a heavier feel or if you want a narrow pre-aluminum Marhoff. It seems like some of the Professionals do have the tapered foot pillars. Shakespeare interchangable parts are like tinker toys; you can make almost anything.

In this case, I believe Jim got that narrow spool from me and it is built on a Sportcast body with Marhoff sides. If it is the same reel, it sure seemed well-aligned, so I am interested in how it fishes.

Len

Warren Platt · Post by **Warren Platt** » Thu Oct 06, 2005 12:36 pm

Tom,
I have two Sportcast reels that were both used for tournament casting in the '40s and '50s and both have aluminum spools. Now on the other hand the narrow spool Marhoff that I got from a tournament caster doesn't. Go figure. I believe he said that he was the one that combined the two reels to make it look like a narrow spool Marhoff. Maybe the Sportcast was offered with and without the aluminum spool. The Sportcast 1973 is a smooth little reel and was very popular with tournament casters for accuracy contests.
Warren

Harvey · Post by **Harvey** » Thu Oct 06, 2005 1:36 pm

I haven't been trying to mix and match parts but from a visual observation, it looks like you can take a Marhoff and a Sportscast apart and exchange parts. I do have a model "GE" sportscast with a steel spool. All the others are earlier and have the light weight alum. spool. I looked thru the catalogues I have and nowhere is a steel spool mentioned. Go Figure. The catalogues state that they came with cork arbors so it looks like it wasn't an add-on, rather it came from the factory like that. And also, a couple I have are balsa, not cork arbors
"H"
And Tom, Your arbors are in the mail.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Oct 06, 2005 7:52 pm

This thing was so well balanced I couldn't wait for Harvey's arbors so I filled it up with line and headed for the greenbelt. Neighbors think I'm a bit touched since there's no water there and they want to know if I'm catching any I reply "You never know".

I cast 1/4, 3/8 and 5/8 oz plugs. Distance, accuracy both with and into the wind was a dream. The alum spool is a perfect match. I think I have a new favorite. jump

Jim Madden · Post by **Jim Madden** » Sun Oct 16, 2005 12:01 am

Len, this isn't cleaned yet, but was the 31 model the only Marhoff with the knob on the wheel and the little graduated plate? Jim

Dale Noll · Post by **Dale Noll** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 4:10 pm

Jim: I have a 1932 Marhoff with the same graduated plate and nob as your 1931 model. The date 1932 is stamped on the tailplate at 6'oclock.

Dale.

Harvey · Post by **Harvey** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 4:20 pm

Guys, I have a Model 31 and a Model 32 with that gizmo. I also have one marked Model 31A. What is the "A" for? And, No, it does not have a light weight spool.
"H"
EDIT: After looking closer, I have a Model "HE" also with a Marbled head plate. (that's 1932)

Dale Noll · Post by **Dale Noll** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 6:23 pm

Guys,

I also have a 1936 -marked with "HE" - with marbelized headplate and crank handles with that gizmo. So far it looks like there is a 31,32, and 36 with the gizmo.

Dale.

Jim Madden · Post by **Jim Madden** » Wed Oct 19, 2005 11:38 pm

Thanks Harvey and Dale. That cast control has a lot of range. I'm surprised the feature didn't last longer. Harvey, with SB reels, an A suffix meant some kind of feature change. I bet if you compare the two 31's closely, you'll notice a difference in something. Jim

Len Sawisch · Post by **Len Sawisch** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 7:42 pm

The dial drag is not on the 1930 Marhoffs that I have, and they are gone by the 1937 model that I have. On the 1937 Marhoff, the drag was moved to a more "modern" drag off the drive gear, where a coined wheel under the handle adjusted the drag (like a star drag without the star points).

So Jim, after five years of production, they switched from a rim lever "spool" drag to a "gear" drag. I have a 1940 with the same drag, and then the 1941 goes back to a spool drag but with the face plate adjustment, not the rim adjustment. This was also the transition to aluminum head covers so there was less to anchor a rim lever to?

Len

PS Harvey, please send me that 31A as I don't appear to have one.

Harvey · Post by **Harvey** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 7:57 pm

Len,
I will send you that 31A then you can clean it up, fondle it for a few days then send it back.

"H"

Len Sawisch · Post by **Len Sawisch** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 10:34 pm

I don't know Harvey, I see quite a bit of green crude on there - that's a pretty heavy clean-up job - how about you send some pictures?

Len

The Real Marhoff Reel

The Real Marhoff Reel

Marhoff & Steve

Alan Baracco note

Oh well . . .

For what I know . . .

Marhoff 31 model

Marhoff

Dial Drag

Gesh